Ancestor hilt or tourist piece?

A. G. Maisey · 15th September 2010, 04:37 AM

Actually Penangsang, "sadak" in Javanese is the betel leaf when it has been rolled into a point with lime in it, ready for chewing. When the bride meets the groom at wedding ceremony, they both throw a sadak onto the floor.

These pestles pictured are for crushing lime and are called "pelecok", from the word "lecok" which becomes "nglecok" : to crush, "dilecok" : crushed.

When you think about it, yes, of course a sadak can overcome invulnerability, because friendship overcomes invulnerability and a sadak can be offered in friendship. Words do not always mean what they might appear to mean.

In Indonesian, which as we know has its origin in Malay as it is spoken in South Sumatra, "gobek" refers to the entire mortar + pestle that is used to crush a complete betel chew to make it easier to consume. I do not know what the pestle alone is called in Indonesian.

PenangsangII · 15th September 2010, 06:05 AM

Ah... yes, you are right Alan, I stand corrected... sadak is the rolled betel leave, and (was said) used by Jaka Tingkir to kill Dadung Awuk. And I also understand that words do not always mean what they might appear to mean, as the duel with Dadung Awok mentioned could just be a metaphor of what jaka Tingkir had done to warrant a punishment (stripped of his position and outcast).

And you are also right about gobek

back to the topic, IMPO, keris of pusoko standard among wong ndeso does not really care about aesthetic, compatibility blade to wrongko or ukiran. As Mrwizard pointed out earlier, the hilt struck very close resemblance to tau-tau statue of Toraja, i think the blade and hilt originated in Sulawesi.

Though Toraja people are not keris bearers, some of their pusakas are actually keris, made in South Sulawesi (ref: Kris Disk by Karsten Sejr Jensen)

15th September 2010, 04:37 AM	#1
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,043	Actually Penangsang, "sadak" in Javanese is the betel leaf when it has been rolled into a point with lime in it, ready for chewing. When the bride meets the groom at wedding ceremony, they both throw a sadak onto the floor. These pestles pictured are for crushing lime and are called "pelecok", from the word "lecok" which becomes "nglecok" : to crush, "dilecok" : crushed. When you think about it, yes, of course a sadak can overcome invulnerability, because friendship overcomes invulnerability and a sadak can be offered in friendship. Words do not always mean what they might appear to mean. In Indonesian, which as we know has its origin in Malay as it is spoken in South Sumatra, "gobek" refers to the entire mortar + pestle that is used to crush a complete betel chew to make it easier to consume. I do not know what the pestle alone is called in Indonesian.

15th September 2010, 06:05 AM	#2
PenangsangII Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 401	Ah... yes, you are right Alan, I stand corrected... sadak is the rolled betel leave, and (was said) used by Jaka Tingkir to kill Dadung Awuk. And I also understand that words do not always mean what they might appear to mean, as the duel with Dadung Awok mentioned could just be a metaphor of what jaka Tingkir had done to warrant a punishment (stripped of his position and outcast). And you are also right about gobek back to the topic, IMPO, keris of pusoko standard among wong ndeso does not really care about aesthetic, compatibility blade to wrongko or ukiran. As Mrwizard pointed out earlier, the hilt struck very close resemblance to tau-tau statue of Toraja, i think the blade and hilt originated in Sulawesi. Though Toraja people are not keris bearers, some of their pusakas are actually keris, made in South Sulawesi (ref: Kris Disk by Karsten Sejr Jensen)