ivory hilt/Madura, tree of life with DATE ?

asomotif · 7th March 2007, 09:53 AM

The Keris was sold on a local dutch website.
It went slightly over my budget, so I had to let it go.

However for the sake of conversation some additional pictures.

PS. a friend suggested that maybe it is not a complete date , but that the 1771 is infact some islamic writting

Some comments on that ?

Best regards,
Willem

Alam Shah · 7th March 2007, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asomotif

...PS. a friend suggested that maybe it is not a complete date , but that the 1771 is infact some islamic writting

Some comments on that ?

I doubt it's Islamic writing. If it is, then it's 1661. But then again, the number 7 does not look like islamic numeral. I guess we'll never know.

Pangeran Datu · 8th March 2007, 02:23 AM

G'day all,

Alan and Shahrial are right of course. There is so much uncertainty involved,
I merely 'stirred the pot to see what would surface'.

BTW Alan, for the sake of being pedantic, I did write: '...some or all of the 3000 or so ...' as I had doubts about the probability of such a large number as well..
On a more serious note though: What has puzzled me from the beginning is the use of Hindu-Arabic/Decimal numbers and the use of the Julian Calendar, if that is indeed what they are. I would have expected something in Arabic or Hanacaraka using the Islamic Calendar or Saka Calendar.
Maybe it was made for the benefit of a European.
Looking at the photo above, I wonder if the '24' could be a '21'?
If so, I'll make another calculated guess:
If it is a date, then it is: 21-1-1771.
Drawing a VERRYYY long bow, this was the DOB of one Vice-Admiral Arnold Adriaan Buyskes, Commissary-General of the Netherlands East Indies 1816-1818.
Maybe the hilt was made to commemorate his DOB.

Cheers

A. G. Maisey · 8th March 2007, 03:43 AM

Probably for his Madurese wife, so she wouldn't forget his birthday.

David · 8th March 2007, 05:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Probably for his Madurese wife, so she wouldn't forget his birthday.

LOL!!!

A. G. Maisey · 8th March 2007, 08:10 AM

Anyway, whoever, or whatever was responsible for this handle, this is a seriously nice keris.Honest old blade with zilch in the bobble-braid department, good ivory handle, and an absolutely lovely wrongko. This sort of thing just does not come along every day. Nice!

David · 8th March 2007, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Anyway, whoever, or whatever was responsible for this handle, this is a seriously nice keris.Honest old blade with zilch in the bobble-braid department, good ivory handle, and an absolutely lovely wrongko. This sort of thing just does not come along every day. Nice!

Yes, i would definitely agree...and i think it went for a rather reasonable price. I'm sorry i didn't know about this auction or i would have certainly considered bidding.

7th March 2007, 09:53 AM	#1
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,237	The Keris was sold on a local dutch website. It went slightly over my budget, so I had to let it go. However for the sake of conversation some additional pictures. PS. a friend suggested that maybe it is not a complete date , but that the 1771 is infact some islamic writting Some comments on that ? Best regards, Willem Attached Images

8th March 2007, 02:23 AM	#3
Pangeran Datu Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 79	G'day all, Alan and Shahrial are right of course. There is so much uncertainty involved, I merely 'stirred the pot to see what would surface'. BTW Alan, for the sake of being pedantic, I did write: '...some or all of the 3000 or so ...' as I had doubts about the probability of such a large number as well.. On a more serious note though: What has puzzled me from the beginning is the use of Hindu-Arabic/Decimal numbers and the use of the Julian Calendar, if that is indeed what they are. I would have expected something in Arabic or Hanacaraka using the Islamic Calendar or Saka Calendar. Maybe it was made for the benefit of a European. Looking at the photo above, I wonder if the '24' could be a '21'? If so, I'll make another calculated guess: If it is a date, then it is: 21-1-1771. Drawing a VERRYYY long bow, this was the DOB of one Vice-Admiral Arnold Adriaan Buyskes, Commissary-General of the Netherlands East Indies 1816-1818. Maybe the hilt was made to commemorate his DOB. Cheers

8th March 2007, 03:43 AM	#4
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,085	Probably for his Madurese wife, so she wouldn't forget his birthday.

8th March 2007, 08:10 AM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,085	Anyway, whoever, or whatever was responsible for this handle, this is a seriously nice keris.Honest old blade with zilch in the bobble-braid department, good ivory handle, and an absolutely lovely wrongko. This sort of thing just does not come along every day. Nice!