I’ve just found some videos on warangan making and using

[David]

Originally Posted by jagabuwana

Milandro, you may want to see this post for a line up of stained blades, one of which has been stained with the sulphur method. It may show you a good comparison.

I believe that while this is indeed an interesting line up of blades stained with different method we must be careful about how we view it for "comparison" purposes. Keep in mind that even with consistent methods applied, different irons will not all respond in the same manner to the same staining method. They will yield various colours when stained dependent upon the iron used. This is why a properly stained blade can be more easily read in terms of tangguh because different eras used different types of iron which will produce different colours when stained. So the colour can be one possible clue as to what era the blade was produced in. At least that is my understanding.

[A. G. Maisey]

I agree with your understanding David.

But what can be read from a properly stained blade goes further than just the characteristics of the iron.

Once the blade has been stained we can also determine the characteristics of the pamor and the way in which it has been worked. Additionally we can identify the existence & extent of the heat treatment (sepuhan). More than this, we can also fairly easily identify any repairs that might have been carried out on the blade during its life.

[Bob A]

Has anyone considered or actually used antimony trioxide in place of arsenic trioxide for the purpose of staining keris?

From what I can cursorily discover, it is considerably less toxic than the arsenic compound, though of course not without risk.

[milandro]

despite what anyone may think of the videos and the maker, they remain onde of the few sources of VISUAL information, here is a video on how to understand some of the problems with warangan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xK9ISHUNj_w

[A. G. Maisey]

Well, I watched it through.

I do admire this gentleman's persistence, however, to spend all this time and all this work to produce an end result that will be inferior to the normal result produced by a non-commercial process in Central Jawa seems to me to be perhaps a little bit pointless.

Yes, I do accept he has started from nothing and is still in the very early stages of his education, but there are easier, faster & better ways to get a far superior end result to the result that this method produces when it is used by an experienced person.

I am not critical of his efforts, he is doing the best he can with the information & understanding he now has, but the method he is trying to use is one designed for commercial use where a man who does this staining work for a living needs to get a number of blades stained in a limited amount of time and make a profit from the result.

I admire his persistance.

[milandro]

perspectives vary quite a bit.

In most part of the world people don’t have any access to professional “ washers” and although there are many videos in Indonesian language(s) there is almost nothing on line to show the proces, let alone break it down into all its parts, in English.

So, as far as I know, this is and remains the best source for those of us who are not living in Indonesia to get closer to see how this is done.

I don’t want to take anything away from professional washing in Indonesia but the option of shipping items to Indonesia and then having them reshipped to you would greatly increase the coffers content of the couriers and the taxman (In Europe EVERY item , even if yours to begin with, entering the Union would be heavily taxed ( VAT 21%) + if you exceed €150 value there would be also import tax + a flat “ handling through customs charge” charged by any postal sevice or courier.

Most people will not do this, leaving their blades unstained (and unhappy, if one believes that the kris likes to be stained with warangan) it would bring the cost of restoring blades sky high , so seeking an alternative takes no business away from the washers in Indonesia (and by the way there are tons of people in Indonesia selling warangan and realgar on line! They must have customers)

So, looking for a DIY instructional videos takes no money away from the professional in Indonesia, just makes a process available were none is


In the NL I fortunately have someone who washes krises at a reasonable price, but even then, wash a few krises and it really adds up!

I opened this thread for all of the people who will have a go at this method.

There are other methods , especially the Rice water+ Salt and Sulphur method.
But until there are beter or different videos , in English, this remains to only alternative for people living in most part of the world to do this themselves

[Anthony G.]

Originally Posted by milandro

perspectives vary quite a bit.

In most part of the world people don’t have any access to professional “ washers” and although there are many videos in Indonesian language(s) there is almost nothing on line to show the proces, let alone break it down into all its parts, in English.

So, as far as I know, this is and remains the best source for those of us who are not living in Indonesia to get closer to see how this is done.

I don’t want to take anything away from professional washing in Indonesia but the option of shipping items to Indonesia and then having them reshipped to you would greatly increase the coffers content of the couriers and the taxman (In Europe EVERY item , even if yours to begin with, entering the Union would be heavily taxed ( VAT 21%) + if you exceed €150 value there would be also import tax + a flat “ handling through customs charge” charged by any postal sevice or courier.

Most people will not do this, leaving their blades unstained (and unhappy, if one believes that the kris likes to be stained with warangan) it would bring the cost of restoring blades sky high , so seeking an alternative takes no business away from the washers in Indonesia (and by the way there are tons of people in Indonesia selling warangan and realgar on line! They must have customers)

So, looking for a DIY instructional videos takes no money away from the professional in Indonesia, just makes a process available were none is


In the NL I fortunately have someone who washes krises at a reasonable price, but even then, wash a few krises and it really adds up!

I opened this thread for all of the people who will have a go at this method.

There are other methods , especially the Rice water+ Salt and Sulphur method.
But until there are beter or different videos , in English, this remains to only alternative for people living in most part of the world to do this themselves

My advice from own DIY experience using warangan solution to those who visits this thread was just leave and live with it if your country does not have professional people to help to 'wash' the keris. Alternatively send to your trusted overseas source to have it wash if you will not encounter legal or shipping issue.

[David]

Originally Posted by milandro

There are other methods , especially the Rice water+ Salt and Sulphur method.
But until there are beter or different videos , in English, this remains to only alternative for people living in most part of the world to do this themselves

Having a video that is in English and clearly lays out steps for this process is great i suppose...if indeed it is showing us a good method that will yield the best results. I must agree with Alan though that the process this gentleman is showing us may in fact not be the best method available for us to follow and certainly not the simplest. The point is that there are other methods of applying warangan, and that when we talk about "other methods" we don't necessarily mean non-arsenic methods. I have not personally done a great deal of blade staining, but i have had much better success with the brush on method that Alan has laid out in his post #36 than anything this gentleman has showed us so far. All the hoops this guy suggests we jump through to create warangan and his method for applying it are unnecessary and may not yield the best results. So following his methods just because they are clearly laid out in an English speaking video does not make much sense to me.
I will also note a couple of other things. While i am quite aware of the pinching method he uses to help get the warangan into the pores of the blade and that indeed many people who do this in Indonesia do it barehanded, i have a hard time recommending people handle an arsenic solution in this manner. I have not done or found any studies on how this kind of practice might affect the health of mranggi who do this consistently over periods of time, but i believe it is not wise to encourage people to handle it with your bare hands as the video shows. Of course, i realize that a lot of things are done in Indonesia that would not pass muster with OSHA or the Canadian Centre for Occupational Health and Safety (CCOHSA). I have seen countless videos of people smithing shirtless and barefoot without wearing any eye protection. It is just the way of things over there. While i accept that i certain can't advocate for the practice though.
Also, while i realize that the blade should be rinsed with running water when finishing this is obviously going to rinse small amounts of arsenic down your drain. Can't say i can be an advocate for such a thing even in small doses.
I also noted when watching this last video that there appeared to be a relative large area of rust that remained on the pesi of the blade he was working on. Yes, the guy has perseverance that is perhaps admirable, but again, i am not impressed by these videos.

[Marcokeris]

what a great success !!! |

Originally Posted by milandro

despite what anyone may think of the videos and the maker, they remain onde of the few sources of VISUAL information, here is a video on how to understand some of the problems with warangan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xK9ISHUNj_w

[milandro]

I would very much welcome other people to make videos, in English, on their (whichever) way to stain krises. As it is, this youtuber and few people who stain blades (not krises ) by means of other methods (also coffee) make up for the only available video resoyrces on line not in Idonesian languages.