interesting jambiya on eBay

[A.alnakkas]

Thanks Gene, I can only be sure with a hot needle test. The seller said its wood but it have alot of similarities with horn items and has some weight to it. The back side shows some fiberous octagonal shapes that I couldnt photograph properly without sunlight.

I'll clean the blade too but might not be worth it. Lovely patina on it and no rust.

[kahnjar1]

Nice piece Lofty. The handle has the bottom silver missing but I'm sure that you should be able to do something about that. The arrangement of the rings looks original as the silver wire linking them does not appear loose. My guess is definately not Omani as there is no typical scroll decoration. I would guess at either Saudi or Yemeni but from the proximity of the Omani border.
As far as the blade is concerned, if there is not rust, just a light rub with an oiled cloth so as not to remove the patina.
Stu

[A.alnakkas]

Thanks Stu, Yep, I can do something about the missing silver. I may take photos and have my Saudi friend take it to a Jambiya maker there maybe.

Took more time in examining the blade, there is some red rust that I should clean off soon. Tiny lines at obscure places.

Included are photos of the blade and hilt, dare I say that there is a chance this would be rhino?

[A.alnakkas]

More photos

[A.alnakkas]

As adviced by Gav

[spiral]

100% rhino.....

Spiral

[A.alnakkas]

Originally Posted by spiral

100% rhino.....

Spiral

Thanks, fits the blade really well ;-)

[Lew]

Originally Posted by A.alnakkas

As adviced by Gav

Rhino for sure outer layer has that orange peel look.

Congrats

Lew

Ibrahiim

The lack of translucency does not mean its not rhino. It depends on how the piece was cut. I have an old Yemeni jambiya and the horn is dark brown the real test is get a high power flashlight and put up against the hilt it should give off a nice glow. The other way to tell is with a magnifier glass look down at the end of the hilt if you see tight fibrous bundles similar to looking down at a handful of thin spaghetti than it's rhino .

Lew

[spiral]

Originally Posted by Lew

The lack of translucency does not mean its not rhino. It depends on how the piece was cut.
Lew

I personaly have found the degree of translucency depends on the darker deposits, { The melanin and calcium content} within the horn Lew ,not the direction of its cut, whichever direction the horn is cut, any translucentcy still remains.

Generaly the lighter the horn colour the greater the translucency.

Dryness, Dirt & lack of oiling also reduce any any apparent translucency.

As an aside, I find it interesting how the different colours of rhino horn are sought after in different parts of the world.

Personaly I rather {like the Bukarans & Nepalese Royalty} prefer the toughest, heaveyist, hardest, strongest & indeed least translucent of then all.

The rarer central inner black core. {The very dark green is also rather nice to but have only ever seen one speciemien.}

The commoner potentialy more jouvenile golds, yellows, oranges, lighter browns etc are very pretty with that lovely glow are much prefered by the Yemmenis, Turks etc.

I understand the Chinese "medicine men" also place vastly different values on the origin, type & colour of horn as well.

Its a Very in depth subject I think, I wish I knew more.

spiral

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by Lew

Rhino for sure outer layer has that orange peel look.

Congrats

Lew

Ibrahiim

The lack of translucency does not mean its not rhino. It depends on how the piece was cut. I have an old Yemeni jambiya and the horn is dark brown the real test is get a high power flashlight and put up against the hilt it should give off a nice glow. The other way to tell is with a magnifier glass look down at the end of the hilt if you see tight fibrous bundles similar to looking down at a handful of thin spaghetti than it's rhino .

Lew

Salaams Lew ~ The spaghetti end of the hilt is an excellent description. I agree with the glowlight approach with a high powered pen torch it often lights up the edges. In this case there is a lot of oil and grime locked in the material so not sure if it will penetrate...but worth a go.
To confuse the issue in Oman Rhino horn is called Z'raff and there is "apparently" a Giraffe hoof horn used for daggers in neighbouring countries.
Your initial response that the item is a mixed Oman/Yemen job is probably right. It looks like a recently traded in article and procured in the Kuwait market. I point to Salalah/Yemen as its area of use in one of the Jebali tribes that straddle the border but Muscat as its point of manufacture either a Muscat 8 Ringer or Royal Khanjar with a distinctly "foreign blade" (three dot) replacement. Quite a detective story.
Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by kahnjar1

Nice piece Lofty. The handle has the bottom silver missing but I'm sure that you should be able to do something about that. The arrangement of the rings looks original as the silver wire linking them does not appear loose. My guess is definately not Omani as there is no typical scroll decoration. I would guess at either Saudi or Yemeni but from the proximity of the Omani border.
As far as the blade is concerned, if there is not rust, just a light rub with an oiled cloth so as not to remove the patina.
Stu

Salaams kahnjar1 and A.alnakkas ~ This is one of the most odd looking khanjars I have ever seen. The blade is from where? possibly Syrian? It could be a Bedouin Omani dagger (It certainly looks Omani ~ Not all Omani daggers have scroll work.) I therefor point to beni Rashid or Murrah Bedouin/ Jebali grouping. The Murra movement box touches Oman and reaches as far as Syria. The silver on the top of the hilt comprising a decorated button with 3 floral pointers or leaves would be repeated in the base of the hilt, facing the opposite direction, The supporting pins are there but it is missing.
Note the peculiar wire ring in amongst the body of rings ~ Is this a replacement for the eighth ring? In which case is this, perhaps, a Muscat 8 ringer? If so the hilt has been modified and rounded...perhaps.

It is old ... and I am surprised that it is Rhino but the hot pin test would prove it. There does not seem to be any translucency therefor I point to wood but if it is Rhino it is a bonus.

One other point~ There is actually no such thing as an area or district in Saudia Arabia close to the Oman border exhibiting artefacts etc or vica versa... only sand. No settlements or towns or ancient villages... Have a look at google earth to dispel this myth. The closest cousin to the Omani royal khanjar is in the Jazan region which was in Yemen on the Red Sea but about 100 years ago was integrated into Saudia ... Sea trade probably took the Royal Omani Khanjar design in that direction from Muscat in "about the mid 19th C". after its design by Sheherezad wife of the Omani Sultan.

I believe this Khanjar is originally Omani (either a royal khanjar or a Muscat Khanjar) adopted by a bedouin owner therefor with a lot of plus and minus about it over the years... not least the blade. This Khanjar could have surfaced in Salalah

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

Notes For an account of the Murrah see; Nomads of the Nomads: The Al Murrah Bedouin of the Empty Quarter [Paperback]
Donald P. Cole.

[A.alnakkas]

Thanks Ibrahim.

Rhino is not necessarily translucent.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by A.alnakkas

Thanks Ibrahim.

Rhino is not necessarily translucent.

Neither is wood...but I hope it is Rhino.

[spiral]

It is.....

Actualy Ibrahiim your hot pin method would only show it is horn not timber.

{Assuming the "pin" is a needle with enough residual heat to actualy burn the horn or timber enough to not only leave a permanent scar but but also to raise the fumes.}

Scientificaly one generaly uses ones eyes to percieve the structure of both horn & timber under magnification to identify them.

spiral

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by spiral

It is.....

Actualy Ibrahiim your hot pin method would only show it is horn not timber.

{Assuming the "pin" is a needle with enough residual heat to actualy burn the horn or timber enough to not only leave a permanent scar but but also to raise the fumes.}

Scientificaly one generaly uses ones eyes to percieve the structure of both horn & timber under magnification to identify them.

spiral

Salaams spiral ~ Yes I agree however there is another sense which one can employ...that of the sense of smell and as you probably know Rhino gives off a burnt hair aroma... wood smells like burning wood. One of the other tests using ones scientifically perceived eyes is the light test with a bright light to view the translucent effect particularly in aged Rhino which is usually dramatic in the peripherary of the test item.
I still hope we are looking at an old Rhino example.
Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.