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Old 18th April 2009, 05:23 PM   #1
Dom
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Default Please, help requested ...

Hi Gentlemen

Please, help requested ... for a translation
for time been it's me is in need

in fact my brother is residing in Tachken - Usbekistan
ask for me my point of view about a dagger,
and translation of the blade mention

the dagger don't seem very old, but brandy new,
somebody know or have an idea about that type

I must confess my total ignorance in cyrillic alphabet, in general
and russian language in particular

could some one may help me for the translation

Thanks per anticipation

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Dom
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Old 18th April 2009, 07:22 PM   #2
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Not a Russian speaker, but I believe the writing to be a name, most likely of the manufacturer: "Nikitin Molev". It is possible that these are two separate last names, perhaps the names of two people who had a knife factory. The "ъ" at the end of Molev, if I am not mistaken, signifies pre-Communist spelling, which would date the kindjal to the beginning of the 19th century.
Regards,
Teodor
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Old 18th April 2009, 10:07 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TVV
The "ъ" at the end of Molev, if I am not mistaken, signifies pre-Communist spelling, which would date the kindjal to the beginning of the 19th century.

Did you mean the beginning of the 20th century? The communist revolution took place in 1917.
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Old 19th April 2009, 02:43 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David
Did you mean the beginning of the 20th century? The communist revolution took place in 1917.


Of course, I meant 20th . Thank you for catching this.
Teodor
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Old 19th April 2009, 10:18 AM   #5
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Teodor, not bad for non-Russian speaker:-)
Dom, Teodor got it right. These are two separate Russian names, and the "ъ" letter signifies 'old Russian' language. Could be factory, maker(s), owner(s), etc. but definitely "Nikitin Molev" are two (or one) last name(s), most likely two, as in case of one name it'd spell as "Nikitin-Molev".
I also agree, the fittings look new, especially the handle, but the blade shows some age based on the picture, so could be old.
But, the "ъ" in the end of 'Molev' is used to make a word ending 'soft', just like on the famous "Medunovъ" mark. Conventionally, one would expect it to be present after 'Nikitin' as well, but it is not. I am not versed in the 'old Russian' grammar, but let's see if other members would be able to clarify my concern.

Last edited by ALEX : 19th April 2009 at 10:31 AM.
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Old 19th April 2009, 11:35 AM   #6
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Both "Nikitin" and "Molev" look like Russian surnames. I think it's not the full name of one person.
As it used to be on caucasian kindjals first name may be the owner's surname and second may be the maker's surname.
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Old 19th April 2009, 01:03 PM   #7
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The absence of Ъ at the end of the name "Nikitin" is puzzling. It clearly strays away from old Russian orthography.
Also, the configuration of the pommel, the liberal use of heavy cast brass fittings, the diamond shape of the blade, overall small size and the ornaments remind me most of Balkan work.
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Old 19th April 2009, 05:18 PM   #8
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Thanks Gentlemen

I was sure to count on you

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Old 19th April 2009, 07:35 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ariel
The absence of Ъ at the end of the name "Nikitin" is puzzling. It clearly strays away from old Russian orthography.
Also, the configuration of the pommel, the liberal use of heavy cast brass fittings, the diamond shape of the blade, overall small size and the ornaments remind me most of Balkan work.


I thought the same thing, but the names sound distinctly Russian. There was a famous knife-making factory in Gabrovo, Bulgaria, which supplied the army with bayonets, but also produced kindjals - "Avramov & Kovachev". If I have Dom's permission to use the pictures, I can ask around.
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Old 19th April 2009, 08:39 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TVV
If I have Dom's permission to use the pictures, I can ask around.
Teodor

Hi Teodor

you may proceed, full permission

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Old 22nd April 2009, 07:54 PM   #11
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Dom, the marking on the kindjal is unknown in Bulgaria. While this does not rule out the Balkans as a possibility, I believe the Serbian spelling would be different, and so the manufacturer should be sought in Russia. The names are Russian anyway.
Sorry I can not be of more help.
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Old 23rd April 2009, 09:47 AM   #12
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Thanks again Teodor
don't apologize
you have clears up very well the situation
and it's very essential and valuable

best regards

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Old 26th April 2009, 12:44 PM   #13
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Now look here:
http://talks.guns.ru/forummessage/79/454210-0.html
Same names, but spelled in Latin.
I think, this supports the Balkan ( Croat???) origin
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Old 28th April 2009, 12:00 AM   #14
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yes Ariel u r correct, exactly same blade
thanks for yr support

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Old 28th April 2009, 02:34 AM   #15
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If anything, the hilt on the example with Latin writing seems Russian to me .
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