Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > Ethnographic Weapons
User Name
Password
FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 22nd December 2016, 08:03 PM   #1
Spaffo
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 26
Default Tourist Kukri?

I've learned more about my knives in one post than I did in the 20 years I've owned them. Thanks all.
I got this kukri last week for $20. I assume it's a tourist piece, but it does have a decent edge and a used scabbard. I'll probably use it and not worry about condition if it's not collection-worthy.
Attached Images
 
Spaffo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd December 2016, 02:06 AM   #2
DaveS
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 321
Default

Spaffo: I could be wrong, but it looks to me to be a W.W. 2 British army issue. The kukri experts on here will be able to tell you for sure, but i don't think it is a tourist piece............Dave.
DaveS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd December 2016, 03:25 AM   #3
Spaffo
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 26
Default

Here is a picture of the other side.
Attached Images
 
Spaffo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd December 2016, 03:48 AM   #4
Battara
EAAF Staff
 
Battara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 5,659
Default

Yes I think Dave got it. It is not a tourist piece, but one that saw real use.

Good for you.
Battara is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd December 2016, 03:38 PM   #5
iskender
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 60
Default broad arrow :

hello spaffo, as a collector of british arms for more than 4o years i can assure you that what was issued regulary has the " broad arrow " stamped in ! best regards iskender
iskender is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd December 2016, 04:17 PM   #6
colin henshaw
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,118
Default

Looks tourist to me. I remember these crude kukris with the lion head on the pommel end, for sale in gift type shops and markets in Britain in the 1960/70s. Along with incense sticks and suchlike.
colin henshaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd December 2016, 05:00 PM   #7
Spaffo
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 26
Default

This does not have the chrome and engraved blade of most of the tourist types. Most of those also have a black leather studded sheath. This one has real edge, although the build quality is not that high.
Spaffo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd December 2016, 06:11 PM   #8
RobertGuy
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 113
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by colin henshaw
Looks tourist to me. I remember these crude kukris with the lion head on the pommel end.

Colin
Here is a typical Indian tourist lion pommel ring hilt kukri. I don't think it looks anything like Spaffos's item. Can't tell you if it's issue from the photos but definately not typical tourist item either.
Attached Images
 
RobertGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th December 2016, 11:39 AM   #9
Henk
Member
 
Henk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,171
Default

Spaffo,

Is it possible to post a picture of the pommel? I don't see a lionhead.
I think the pommel can tell us something more. What i see at the moment is a fine kukri.
Henk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th December 2016, 02:18 PM   #10
Spaffo
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 26
Default

Here is the pommel.
Attached Images
 
Spaffo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th December 2016, 02:28 PM   #11
mrcjgscott
Member
 
mrcjgscott's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 189
Default Kukri...

What you have there is a commercially produced version of the military MK.5 kukri.

These did not appear until the late 1950's to 1960's, so not WW2 issue I am afraid.

They vary in quality hugely, from very poor to quite decent camping knives. From the rather poorly constructed scabbard, I would estimate that yours dates from the 1970's or perhaps 1980's.

If you are interested in Military Kukris, you can do no better than to read Jonathan's excellent article on the military marks 1-5:

http://www.ikrhs.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1203

For some kukris to avoid, see these two:

http://www.ikrhs.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1205

http://www.ikrhs.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1390

I hope this helps. I often check in to look for a good kukri thread, they seem to have been few and far between of late.

Seasons greetings,

Chris
mrcjgscott is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th December 2016, 10:15 PM   #12
Spaffo
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 26
Default

Thanks Chris. Those links were very informative.
Spaffo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th December 2016, 01:33 AM   #13
rickystl
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: St. Louis, MO area.
Posts: 1,147
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertGuy
Colin
Here is a typical Indian tourist lion pommel ring hilt kukri. I don't think it looks anything like Spaffos's item. Can't tell you if it's issue from the photos but definately not typical tourist item either.

Hi Robert.

While mostly a novice with Kukris, I remember purchasing this exact one from a high-end antique gun shop back in 1965, Think I paid $11.00 for it then. LOL they had a large one, and a smaller one they called the officers model. I got the larger one. I was only 15 years old then and my muther had to make the purchase since I was not 18 yet. I remember having it sharpened and carrying it in the woods on many exploritory expeditions. LOL Anyway, as they say........thanks for the memories.

Rick
rickystl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th December 2016, 01:54 AM   #14
Battara
EAAF Staff
 
Battara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 5,659
Default

Thank you Mrcjscott, I learned. My interest in kukris drops off around WWI and so I know little about those after.
Battara is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th December 2016, 06:47 AM   #15
RobertGuy
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 113
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rickystl
Hi Robert.

I remember having it sharpened and carrying it in the woods on many exploritory expeditions. LOL Anyway, as they say........thanks for the memories.

Rick

No problem Rickysti. That was my first kukri (which I still have). I think these tourist kukris served to introduce many people to the type. Just so long as they are not sold to them as genuine military or tribal items.
RobertGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th December 2016, 03:17 PM   #16
rickystl
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: St. Louis, MO area.
Posts: 1,147
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertGuy
No problem Rickysti. That was my first kukri (which I still have). I think these tourist kukris served to introduce many people to the type. Just so long as they are not sold to them as genuine military or tribal items.

Hi Robert.

Much agreed. For many years I carried a Kukri while on camping and hunting trips. You have to actually use one to appreciate why they were so popular. The one I still use is the military "styled" one, with the two-rivit handle sold by Atlanta Cutlery. It makes short work while cutting small branches or gathering kindling wood. Even the small knives are really handy for cutting twine - or even a steak LOL.
That said, I can also see the historical collector interest in certain varities. I've seen ones posted by Forum members I wouldn't dream of taking into the field. LOL They are beautiful.

Question: I'm sure this has been answered before on the Forum, but what decade do you think the Kukri originated ? 18___?

Thanks, Rick.
rickystl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th December 2016, 07:45 PM   #17
RobertGuy
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 113
Default

Rickysti
I think it is a very old form. Wikipedia states there are examples dating back to 1550 or so. I think the Britsh first came across them in the Gurkha war of 1814-16. Wikipedia is not always the most accurate source so there may be more authoritative answers to be had from forumites here.
RobertGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th December 2016, 12:58 AM   #18
Battara
EAAF Staff
 
Battara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 5,659
Default

Robertguy, you have a good point and yes the British did meet up with them when they fought the Nepalise.

I have an example of one that has been dated back to the 1700s. So they must be much older than that.
Battara is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th December 2016, 09:49 PM   #19
iskender
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 60
Default falcata ? greek kopis ?

my personal opinion is that the form of the kukri was introduced by alexander the great and his army invading india , in form of the kopis. best regards iskender
iskender is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2016, 03:47 PM   #20
mrcjgscott
Member
 
mrcjgscott's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 189
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaffo
Thanks Chris. Those links were very informative.


A pleasure Spaffo, always pleased to see kukri being discussed, whatever their form!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Battara
Thank you Mrcjscott, I learned. My interest in kukris drops off around WWI and so I know little about those after.


Mine too Battara. However, I think it always pays to know as much as one can about these things, and as kukris are a particular area of interest, I try to study them all, the good, the bad, and even the ugly.
mrcjgscott is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2016, 03:59 PM   #21
mrcjgscott
Member
 
mrcjgscott's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 189
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rickystl

Question: I'm sure this has been answered before on the Forum, but what decade do you think the Kukri originated ? 18___?

Thanks, Rick.


Hi Rick,

A good and much discussed question! I believe at present, the earliest attributed kukris are those residing in the National Museum of Nepal. The ticket says they were the weapons of Drabya Shah, who ruled from 1559-1570 AD.

That of course, doesn't mean that is the earliest kukri, just the earliest "attributed" kukri.

As previously mentioned, plenty show up in the UK, provenanced as dating from the Anglo-Nepali war (1814-16).

We may never know the true origin, the Greek Kopis Hypothesis is as good as any!

Kind regards,

Chris
mrcjgscott is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2016, 03:01 PM   #22
rickystl
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: St. Louis, MO area.
Posts: 1,147
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrcjgscott
Hi Rick,

A good and much discussed question! I believe at present, the earliest attributed kukris are those residing in the National Museum of Nepal. The ticket says they were the weapons of Drabya Shah, who ruled from 1559-1570 AD.

That of course, doesn't mean that is the earliest kukri, just the earliest "attributed" kukri.

As previously mentioned, plenty show up in the UK, provenanced as dating from the Anglo-Nepali war (1814-16).

We may never know the true origin, the Greek Kopis Hypothesis is as good as any!

Kind regards,

Chris

Thanks for your reply Chris. Well, one thing I just learned: The Kukri pattern seems to be older than I thought. I was thinking it's origin was around the turn of the 19th Century. Obviously, it is older. It certainly has a colorful history. Finding it so useful as a field tool in modern times, I can appreciate it being indespensible back in the period. The fact they continued to be in use during WWII and beyond seems to validate this.
Rick
rickystl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2017, 12:31 PM   #23
sirupate
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: England
Posts: 373
Default

Yep that is an Indian made kukri, Atlanta Cutlery, they call it an 'Officers Kukri'
Atlanta Cutlery Officers kukri

There isn't a Mk5 btw, the last 'Official' Mark Kukri was the disastrous Wilkinson Sword Mk4

The link to the correspondence with the 2nd GR Historian should prove useful putting to bed some myths and inaccuracies in other articles

Correspondence with 2nd GR Historian

There is also a lot of further and accurate info here;
Historical Info

The very best Simon
sirupate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2017, 10:15 PM   #24
RobertGuy
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 113
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sirupate
There isn't a Mk5 btw, the last 'Official' Mark Kukri was the disastrous Wilkinson Sword Mk4

Sirupate
How is today's issue Kukr classified? Does it have a NATO number?

Question for Spaffo:
Does your Kukri have a wooden or horn handle? I presumed wood from the first picture but with Sirupate mentioning the Atlanta Cutlery ones which have horn handles I'm, not so sure now.
RobertGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd January 2017, 05:35 PM   #25
sirupate
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: England
Posts: 373
Default

Hi Robert Guy, they are classified as Service no.1 or Service no.2, there is no NATO number as the RGR deal with the orders themselves, as opposed to the MOD. Also if you're on FB join my FB page for loads of info (PDF).
Pics from the Gurkha Museum in Pokhara (Nepal)
Attached Images
  
sirupate is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 11:37 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin Version 3.0.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.