Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > European Armoury
User Name
Password
FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 20th February 2015, 07:08 PM   #1
blue lander
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 456
Default A 17th century dagger?

Just won this one for a very suspiciously low price... The seller says it's late 17th century and authentic but I wouldn't be surprised if it's a repro (albeit an older one). I like the looks of it either way. What do you think?

45.5 cm total, 31cm blade
Attached Images
    

Last edited by blue lander : 20th February 2015 at 07:32 PM.
blue lander is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th February 2015, 11:23 PM   #2
Will M
Member
 
Will M's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: In the wee woods north of Napanee Ontario
Posts: 112
Default

Has a nice profile and at least 100 years old.

Is that small mark by the cross guard a mark stamped into it?
Will M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st February 2015, 05:28 AM   #3
M ELEY
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: NC, U.S.A.
Posts: 1,359
Default

I agree with Will. Perhaps a Victorian-era reproduction of high quality. Hate to use the word 'repro' when describing these types, as (most) were made of very high quality to represent their originals. Created for the astute English gentleman for his trophy room or den when the demand far outreached the supply...
M ELEY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st February 2015, 05:48 PM   #4
blue lander
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 456
Default

These are the only pictures I have of it. The seller's in Ukraine so it's going to take awhile to get here. Hopefully it's as sturdily made as it looks.

Any idea what kind of dagger it's supposed to be? A main gauche?
blue lander is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st February 2015, 11:00 PM   #5
Sajen
Member
 
Sajen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Germany, Dortmund
Posts: 5,963
Default

Very nice dagger with good age, like it very much! When you don't like it send it to me.

Regards,
Detlef
Sajen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22nd February 2015, 12:57 AM   #6
blue lander
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 456
Default

Thanks! I'm not getting my hopes up yet, I'll be surprised if the sale was legit. Besides the super low price, it was the seller's first auction. He also only wanted 12 euros to ship to the us which is the same amount he wanted for western Europe. Just doesn't add up. But the price was low enough to make it worth the risk.
blue lander is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22nd February 2015, 03:32 AM   #7
M ELEY
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: NC, U.S.A.
Posts: 1,359
Default

With roughly a 12" blade, it could easily be a parrying dagger, especially with the longer quillons. Strictly speaking, the Spanish main gauche had hilts that covered the hand with a semi-basket guard. Not sure if the wooden grip is a replacement or ?. The grip does remind one of some of the Holbein styles of daggers of the same period. Loosely speaking, of course. I'm trying to remember where I've seen the grip style before. Not a Rondel, but perhaps a pattern along the same lines? Dagger experts out there?
M ELEY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22nd February 2015, 03:48 AM   #8
M ELEY
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: NC, U.S.A.
Posts: 1,359
Default

OPPS! Stand corrected about gauches. Some were indeed 'open', with either a ring guard or just the extended quillons.

Hey Blue, if this piece turns out to be legit, you have got yourself a sweet find! If Victorian repro, its still an excellent deal for the price. If a modern repro, its what you paid and appears quality made. If not shipped at all, ouch!

Take some more closeup pics of the wood hilt when (if!) it arrives. My poor eyes start to see things, like legit aging/patina (??) and possibly worm holes (?). Wormy ash wood was an extremely popular wood used for dagger hilts, pike hafts, etc, back in the day...
M ELEY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22nd February 2015, 09:26 AM   #9
Sajen
Member
 
Sajen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Germany, Dortmund
Posts: 5,963
Default

Good luck for receiving it!
Sajen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22nd February 2015, 11:54 PM   #10
blue lander
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 456
Default

I guess there's nothing to do now but wait. Here's two more pictures from the auction I forgot to include.
Attached Images
  
blue lander is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd February 2015, 03:50 AM   #11
Will M
Member
 
Will M's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: In the wee woods north of Napanee Ontario
Posts: 112
Default

I hope you have good luck getting it.

One thing you can do is ask to have a photo sent to you with something particular beside the item like that days newspaper, it proves the seller owns it.

A few years ago there was a European seller on Ebay who copied other sellers photos from their listing and used these to make his auction for the sword.
He never owned the sword, just started a listing and collected payment.

When you scan auctions enough you remember seeing particular photos.
That seller was soon kicked off but they have a way of creeping back.
Will M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd February 2015, 01:45 PM   #12
blue lander
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 456
Default

Thanks, that's good advice.

I know it's tacky to say how much you paid for something, but for the point of context, I got this for a "buy it now" price of 30 euros. That's barely enough to be worth stealing.
blue lander is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd February 2015, 01:51 PM   #13
fernando
Lead Moderator European Armoury
 
fernando's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal
Posts: 6,340
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by blue lander
... I know it's tacky to say how much you paid for something, but for the point of context ...

For the point of context alright
fernando is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd February 2015, 03:25 PM   #14
Will M
Member
 
Will M's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: In the wee woods north of Napanee Ontario
Posts: 112
Default

The seller forgot the other "zero"
Will M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd February 2015, 04:01 PM   #15
blue lander
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 456
Default

Or maybe he meant it to be an auction and 30 euros was just the starting price.
blue lander is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th February 2015, 07:09 PM   #16
blue lander
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 456
Default

Update: The guy put up a few more auctions, most of which started at 30 euros. I bid on and won a rather unremarkable kindjal from him. The seller contacted me and said he'd combine shipping with the 17th century dagger. So I guess that means he at least intends to send it to me...
blue lander is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 11:21 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin Version 3.0.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.