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Old 25th June 2011, 05:06 PM   #1
asomotif
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Unhappy BANJARMASIN KERIS, unfortunately not mine

Unfortunately I was not able to purchase this one.
But after a few weeks I sort of grew over the dissapointment and now want to share the pictures to enjoy ,for reference and discussion

It was offered as a restoration project.
Funny enough a lot of buyers suggested to the seller that the pendok could not be the original as it should have been more decorated/embellished

Note the wrangka's decoration on floral motif on both sides.

Best regards,
Willem
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Old 25th June 2011, 06:09 PM   #2
Battara
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Wow - that's a horn wranga. Is this a type of rhino horn?
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Old 25th June 2011, 06:12 PM   #3
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ukiran and top-sarong seem very very nice
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Old 25th June 2011, 06:19 PM   #4
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Hi Willem,

thank's for sharing. very nice sampir. I think from "white buffalo" horn. Can we see the blade as well?

Regards,

Detlef
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Old 25th June 2011, 08:40 PM   #5
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I think the wrangka is Buffalohorn.
Not as special as rhino, but still quite a large peice of buffalohorn.
It must have accounted for certain status.


Here some more pictures.
The blade is not cleaned and not photographed in a good way.
But it gives an impression.
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Old 25th June 2011, 09:02 PM   #6
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Hello Willem,
The sheath crosspiece made from carved horn is very nice indeed but besides the hilt, what makes it a Banjarmasin kris?
Best regards
Jean
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Old 26th June 2011, 01:15 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean
but besides the hilt, what makes it a Banjarmasin kris?

Hello Jean,
There is not very much information around, but as far as I know the blades are always import blades. So there is not a "Banjarmasin" style of blades.

So I call it Banjarmasin when the hilt is banjarmasin.
From pictures in other threads I found that often the wrangka is quite simple and sometimes almost symetric in design.
Further, the examples I found with pendok's all have very simple brass plain pendoks.

This wrangka has a floral decoration something which is found more often in the Banjarmasin area due to muslim influence. It is also known from Negara weapons. such as parang nabur;s and the scarce negara mandau's.

If someone has more and/or different info on this I would surely like to hear it.

Best regards,
Willem
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Old 26th June 2011, 09:26 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asomotif
Hello Jean,
There is not very much information around, but as far as I know the blades are always import blades. So there is not a "Banjarmasin" style of blades.

So I call it Banjarmasin when the hilt is banjarmasin.
From pictures in other threads I found that often the wrangka is quite simple and sometimes almost symetric in design.
Further, the examples I found with pendok's all have very simple brass plain pendoks.

This wrangka has a floral decoration something which is found more often in the Banjarmasin area due to muslim influence. It is also known from Negara weapons. such as parang nabur;s and the scarce negara mandau's.

If someone has more and/or different info on this I would surely like to hear it.

Best regards,
Willem


Hello Willem,
I agree that there is very little information about the Banjarmasin krisses.
According to Van Duuren's book "The Kris" page 82, many kris blades were forged in Negara during the 19th Century so not all the blades were imported.
Regarding the warangka crosspiece, most of them have a special kidney shape as shown in Frey's book page 72 for instance and other reference books. I never saw a crosspiece shaped like the one on your pictures but I would rather attribute its origin to East Java/ Madura.
Would you attribute my kris to Banjarmasin also since it has a Banjar hilt?
Best regards
Jean
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Old 27th June 2011, 06:21 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean
Would you attribute my kris to Banjarmasin also since it has a Banjar hilt?
Best regards
Jean

Dear Jean,
Do you have better pictures of the hilt.

Best regards,
Willem
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Old 27th June 2011, 09:28 AM   #10
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I am with Jean on this. You see Banjar hilts quite often on keris in other regions too.

Michael
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Old 27th June 2011, 11:57 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VVV
I am with Jean on this. You see Banjar hilts quite often on keris in other regions too.

Michael


Michael,
- Do you mean īn other regions" or from other regions ?

- as for the wrangka. the floral decoration on this type wrangka is new to me.
Is this something you see on east java / madura keris ?
if so, please post some examples

best regards,
Willem

Last edited by asomotif : 27th June 2011 at 12:11 PM.
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Old 27th June 2011, 01:19 PM   #12
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Willem, I mean in other regions.
Somewhere I have read that the Banjar hilts were quite popular and that's why they were imported to other regions (I can't remember in which keris book I have read this at the moment. But I will get back to you when I find it unless some of the other collectors find it before me) .
Now and then you see the Banjar nunggak semi version for instance on Javanese keris. Both more recent combinations, like at "HH" , but I have also seen them on keris in old collections and museums.
In Tropen there is a keris collected in Lampung with a similar Banjar hilt as yours (below). But the rest of the keris doesn't look like neither a traditional Banjar nor Lampung combination so it's hard to know it's story...

Michael
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Last edited by VVV : 27th June 2011 at 02:23 PM. Reason: added comment and Tropen example
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Old 27th June 2011, 01:22 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asomotif
Dear Jean,
Do you have better pictures of the hilt.

Best regards,
Willem


Dear Willem,
Attached are additional pictures of my hilt. I believe that it is original but in exceptional condition so may be not very old, the missing stones visible on the pictures were replaced.
Best regards
Jean
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Old 27th June 2011, 04:38 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean
I believe that it is original but in exceptional condition so may be not very old, the missing stones visible on the pictures were replaced.
Best regards
Jean


Interesting hilt.
The technique / workmanship looks very authenthic to me.
Could it be that it was re-gilded ? Do you have any provenance ?

Best regards,
Willem
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Old 27th June 2011, 08:34 PM   #15
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Hello Willem,
The filigree decoration looks more elaborate than on some other (older?) pieces. The selut seems matching, I saw the pictures of a similar one belonging to a famous German collector recently. I don't know if the piece was recently gilded or not but would not think so because of the stones. Regarding the origin of the kris, it was found and refurbished by my partner in Solo.
Best regards
Jean
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Old 27th June 2011, 09:44 PM   #16
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Are these thin gold or gilt silver/brass? They look like gilt brass to me...
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Old 27th June 2011, 11:30 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Battara
Are these thin gold or gilt silver/brass? They look like gilt brass to me...


Yep, normally they are gilt brass. Is that a bad thing
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Old 28th June 2011, 02:38 AM   #18
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Nope just curious - gold would be royal and more expensive.
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