Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > Keris Warung Kopi

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 17th June 2019, 03:37 PM   #31
A. G. Maisey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 6,259
Default

A crop.

The blade indentation is damage

Gustav, why do you say the von Sulz keris is heavily reshaped?
Attached Images
 
A. G. Maisey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th June 2019, 11:57 PM   #32
Gustav
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,065
Default

Alan, just to be sure - the area marked with red is damaged? Thank you for the cropped image.

Regarding von Sulz Keris - because the distance between center ridge and blade edge varies a lot. Generally it seems to have lost its original width above Sorsoran, it looks to me just like the edges were resharpened, sometimes seen on Keris in Europa used as (hunting) weapons. Very similar look above Sorsoran has the Keris on p. 94 in Jensen's book.
Attached Images
  

Last edited by Gustav; 18th June 2019 at 12:34 AM.
Gustav is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th June 2019, 12:40 AM   #33
A. G. Maisey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 6,259
Default

Yes Gustav, the area you have marked with red is a big chip out of the blade.

Thank you for your reasoning on the possible re-working of the blade.
A. G. Maisey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2022, 01:05 PM   #34
Gavin Nugent
Member
 
Gavin Nugent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,479
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gustav View Post
Alan, just to be sure - the area marked with red is damaged? Thank you for the cropped image.

Regarding von Sulz Keris - because the distance between center ridge and blade edge varies a lot. Generally it seems to have lost its original width above Sorsoran, it looks to me just like the edges were resharpened, sometimes seen on Keris in Europa used as (hunting) weapons. Very similar look above Sorsoran has the Keris on p. 94 in Jensen's book.
I know little about these old keris and the history attached to them, but just a casual uninformed passing comment... there are numerous Sulawesi keris that in one sense or another follow this profile

I continue to read and learn.
Gavin Nugent is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th August 2022, 11:33 PM   #35
A. G. Maisey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 6,259
Default

Thank you for your comment Gavin.

When you say that some Sulawesi keris have a profile similar to the stone carving that has a chip, I have never seen this, could you perhaps post an image of one or more of these Sulawesi keris with a profile similar to the chipped stone carving?
A. G. Maisey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st September 2022, 11:38 AM   #36
Gavin Nugent
Member
 
Gavin Nugent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,479
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey View Post
Thank you for your comment Gavin.

When you say that some Sulawesi keris have a profile similar to the stone carving that has a chip, I have never seen this, could you perhaps post an image of one or more of these Sulawesi keris with a profile similar to the chipped stone carving?
Apologies for the mis quote Alan, I was referring to the keris Gustav presented, just loosely speaking...the first image is a rather acute cut away where more traditional lines flow through this area in a nice sweeping curve.. the second one, whilst not a pronounced cut away, does exhibit some features that are aligned with the von Sulz keris... to my eye at least...
Attached Images
  
Gavin Nugent is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st September 2022, 11:55 AM   #37
A. G. Maisey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 6,259
Default

I'm sorry Gavin, but I don't really understand what you mean.

What I can see is the von Sulz keris with its slightly unusual form, and the two sections of keris that you have posted with nothing unusual at all that I can see.

Even the von Sulz form can be found in some Javanese keris of a later date.

To me, all three of these keris are just forms that fall within the parameters of Javanese & other keris form.

Gustav thought that the von Sulz keris might have been reshaped, & that is possible, probably most older keris have been reshaped somewhere along the line, part of the maintenance procedure for keris calls for frayed or chipped edges to be tidied up, so over time the keris loses its original form.

The von Sulz might have been reshaped for some other reason, to me all this is normal & expected its probably not even worth comment, it is just what happens.
A. G. Maisey is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 01:21 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.