Unidentified Cavalry Saber of French Mfg...

laEspadaAncha · 15th March 2010, 03:21 AM

Howdy Hotspur,

Thank you for the feedback and the links.

I have in fact visited that link in the past. I agree with the description of the CW attribution as "spurious." I have several CW swords in various patterns, dated, named and otherwise, and IMO, in the absence of these particularities, one cannot attach such an attribution with any degree of certitude.

I do have references with plates of French cav. sabers spanning the 19th C. However, I cannot find a solid match... For instance, the M1896 in your second link lacks the backstrap and curved blade present on this example, and the guard is of a more symmetrical design. The M1822 appears a closer match (as it does in my reference material) but again, lacks a backstrap. Furthermore, it is my understanding that the mfg. of French govt. issue swords was moved from Kligenthal to Chatellerault prior to 1850...

My example does have a scabbard - single ring and asymmetrical drag.

laEspadaAncha · 15th March 2010, 05:04 AM

A couple more pictures...

laEspadaAncha · 15th March 2010, 06:59 AM

Upon further review, it does seem to share similarities with a published reference I have to a French cavalry officer's sword dated c. 1870. It, too, has a 4-bar decorated brass hilt, horn grip, and a personalized monogram on the backstrap near the pommel...

However, it differs in the treatment of the quillon (lacking on my example), and I still have the question re: the Kligenthal manufacture - were French cav. officers allowed the option of private purchase?

Hotspur · 16th March 2010, 05:27 PM

I would think absolutely yes, to private purchases and more likely the norm for officers. There are also notes out there for the rather prolific private sales of swords from the Klingenthal works.

What struck me the most about later than earlier was the flatness of the guard stock, as opposed to the rounder castings. Add also the timeline for going to single ring scabbards, many refitted from two to one in the 1880s (but we should never assume dating from the attached scabbards without due considerations).

Cheers

GC

15th March 2010, 03:21 AM	#1
laEspadaAncha Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 608	Howdy Hotspur, Thank you for the feedback and the links. I have in fact visited that link in the past. I agree with the description of the CW attribution as "spurious." I have several CW swords in various patterns, dated, named and otherwise, and IMO, in the absence of these particularities, one cannot attach such an attribution with any degree of certitude. I do have references with plates of French cav. sabers spanning the 19th C. However, I cannot find a solid match... For instance, the M1896 in your second link lacks the backstrap and curved blade present on this example, and the guard is of a more symmetrical design. The M1822 appears a closer match (as it does in my reference material) but again, lacks a backstrap. Furthermore, it is my understanding that the mfg. of French govt. issue swords was moved from Kligenthal to Chatellerault prior to 1850... My example does have a scabbard - single ring and asymmetrical drag.

15th March 2010, 05:04 AM	#2
laEspadaAncha Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 608	A couple more pictures...

15th March 2010, 06:59 AM	#3
laEspadaAncha Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 608	Upon further review, it does seem to share similarities with a published reference I have to a French cavalry officer's sword dated c. 1870. It, too, has a 4-bar decorated brass hilt, horn grip, and a personalized monogram on the backstrap near the pommel... However, it differs in the treatment of the quillon (lacking on my example), and I still have the question re: the Kligenthal manufacture - were French cav. officers allowed the option of private purchase?

16th March 2010, 05:27 PM	#4
Hotspur Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Nipmuc USA Posts: 524	I would think absolutely yes, to private purchases and more likely the norm for officers. There are also notes out there for the rather prolific private sales of swords from the Klingenthal works. What struck me the most about later than earlier was the flatness of the guard stock, as opposed to the rounder castings. Add also the timeline for going to single ring scabbards, many refitted from two to one in the 1880s (but we should never assume dating from the attached scabbards without due considerations). Cheers GC