A Spanish escopeta

[M ELEY]

Absolutely beautiful piece, Fernando! Where did you find such an intact piece! When I first saw that threaded hole, I thought perhaps there might be one on the other side (as in, mounted with a swivel base), but not the case. I am excited to hear what the experts have to say about this fantastic percussion piece. Congrats again!

[fernando]

Originally Posted by M ELEY

Absolutely beautiful piece, Fernando! Where did you find such an intact piece! When I first saw that threaded hole, I thought perhaps there might be one on the other side (as in, mounted with a swivel base), but not the case. I am excited to hear what the experts have to say about this fantastic percussion piece. Congrats again!

Thank you Mark,
It must be some kind of suspension device, although this intrigues me, as such characteristic would better fit shorter items, like pistols or short blunderbusses and carbines.
This escopeta measures 1,25 mt (1ft 2"); if you held it from the belt by the spot where the threaded hole is, it would nearly touch the ground. And this is no cavalry weapon, i would say?
The truth is that this shotgun has no hanging belt, which is unusual. Maybe this hipothetical ring would do the job ... but how? .
Let them experts pop up and tell us something about that
Fernando

[celtan]

Nando,

That's just what I thought. Yesterday I received a book.with copious illustrations of Napoleonic french soldiers, many of whom were dragoons.

They were depicted as carrying a carbine hanging from a shoulder belt, or even from the saddle's horn, attached to the gun in the same area yours has that hole. So I guess it was probably a ring, to carry the carbine at the ready while hunting from a horse.

BTW, the flintlock continued to be made and used in Spain until ~ 1850, never mind the more modern Percussion-locks.

Beautiful piece, nonetheless!

Best

M

Originally Posted by fernando

Thank you Mark,
It must be some kind of suspension device, although this intrigues me, as such characteristic would better fit shorter items, like pistols or short blunderbusses and carbines.
This escopeta measures 1,25 mt (1ft 2"); if you held it from the belt by the spot where the threaded hole is, it would nearly touch the ground. And this is no cavalry weapon, i would say?
The truth is that this shotgun has no hanging belt, which is unusual. Maybe this hipothetical ring would do the job ... but how? .
Let them experts pop up and tell us something about that
Fernando

[M ELEY]

http://issuu.com/dreamedia/docs/catalog_148_comancheria

Check out lot #185 on pg 78-79. It resembles Fernando's very much. Interestingly, I thought these were percussion cap the first time I saw one. This one dates to the 18th c.?

I just love this catalog of Native American/Span colonial stuff-

[fernando]

Originally Posted by M ELEY

http://issuu.com/dreamedia/docs/catalog_148_comancheria

Check out lot #185 on pg 78-79. It resembles Fernando's very much. Interestingly, I thought these were percussion cap the first time I saw one. This one dates to the 18th c.?

I just love this catalog of Native American/Span colonial stuff-

Great catalogue, Mark ... thanks a lot for the link.
Well, i think it resembles mine a lot because that type of stock has a definite influence and impact; so does the lock, although mine was born in the percussion type. I also have these locks converted, by the way.
A consistent difference between both is that mine has a 'full' stock, ie, the stock forend goes up to the barrel mouth. According to a specialist in Spanish arms, this is an unusual feature for the period.
The same specialist (Juan L. Calvó) also sugests that the barrel in mine could have well been from a 18th century flintlock, a practice most used by 19th century gunmakers. This is the so called barrel with 'culatin'; the barrel is intersected at the breech to assemble a percussion bolster section, and then coupled back to the original tang.
Another interesting particularity is that, the shoulder stock in mine, besides being more refined, has a groove on the right side, but not in the left, probably not to molest the shooter's face.
I am most pleased that this expert has well praised my example; and for what i see in the example shown in the catalogue (price wise) and some local opinions, i have made a good deal.
Fernando

.

[M ELEY]

A good deal indeed, my friend! Yours is a beautiful piece that would honor anyone's collection.

[Philip]

Hi, Fernando
Congratulations on a piece in so fine condition, complete and not "monkeyed with"! It's obvious that it was made by someone with considerable skill, the fit and finish is very good and it appears to have had good care given to it during its working life.

In response to Norman's post: yes, the "boot" shaped Catalan stock dates from way before when this piece was made, the 17th cent. at least, it not before. James D. Lavin's A HISTORY OF SPANISH FIREARMS (1965) would be one place to learn about the development of this form.

Regarding the "late" appearance of the "llave de patilla": yes, it's true that the "French" lock and its percussion successors had made considerable inroads into the Iberian during the early 19th cent., as with anything else the transition was not uniform. Gunsmiths, and their customers, in the more sophisticated larger metro areas would have learned about and embraced the new styles earlier, whereas the provinces stayed rather conservative. Here in the US I have encountered over the years a number of mousequetons and blunderbusses brougnt to America by early Basque immigrants (they were mostly sheep herders who used the weapons for defense) and the majority of them had traditional miquelet locks like this one. Some were made as percussion, others were conversions judging from the filled holes in the lockplates for the now-unneeded screws and pins for the divers parts of the older flint system.