Colonial hanger, Spanish dagger or ?

M ELEY · 19th November 2009, 02:09 PM

Hello, Dmitry, and thanks for coming in on this one. I'm still working on getting them loaded and will probably end up sending them off to Fernando for uploading. I am now convinced that the strapwork around the hilt is indeed low-grade pewter and not lead as I initially thought. It is soft enough that I can slightly scratch it with my thumb nail, but where it has broken away from the wood grip, it is brittle and non-bendable. It's not white metal, but I guess it could still be some other alloy. Tin? I know tin-smithing was around then. Have to do more research. I still think it's a contstant for early American, but also Span colonial.

M ELEY · 19th November 2009, 06:02 PM

Trying again...

M ELEY · 19th November 2009, 06:08 PM

More pics...

M ELEY · 19th November 2009, 06:11 PM

Thanks, Rick! That program you recommended was easy to use. I did it myself- gasp!

M ELEY · 19th November 2009, 06:19 PM

The sword measures just under 22" long with a 17" blade, so I guess it could be either a short hanger or long dagger. As already stated, the interesting wood grip cut with grooves with metal strapwork (damaged on one side). The alloy isn't white metal, silver, or lead (not soft enough). It could be tin or pewter (I suspect the latter). Note the small hole in the quillon, possibly for a chain link or knot? So...what is it? Euro hanger, colonial piece, Spanish espada? Dagger or sword? Late 18th, early or mid-19th? Thanks all.

katana · 19th November 2009, 06:24 PM

Hi
I would not rule out Africa......there are a number of similar swords originating from West Africa.....Although I have not seen one with the 'spiral' decorated hilt.

All the best
David

katana · 19th November 2009, 06:58 PM

Just a quick thought....the metal 'spiral' could be a zinc alloy. Africans are masters of utilising any resource. They obtain the zinc alloy from the outer casing of dry cell batteries. (invented late 19th C).

Bearing in mind many areas are fairly remote from electrical supplies, the use of batteries by colonalists was increasingly more widespread as the 20th C progressed. Discharged batteries were not re-chargeable and discarded.

A fairly similar sword from Africa
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=toureg

Regards David

.

katana · 19th November 2009, 06:18 PM

Hi M Eley

,
well done

Having loads of teenagers around I had to learn quickly...to save face

Hope you don't mind ..I have re-edited your picture and reposted. I'm lucky, I have a photo editor which is easy to use.

All the best
David

Ah dear......since writing this post.......loads more pictures have been posted

You have obviously mastered it now

.

fernando · 19th November 2009, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M ELEY

Trying again...

.

Fernando

19th November 2009, 02:09 PM	#1
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,158	Hello, Dmitry, and thanks for coming in on this one. I'm still working on getting them loaded and will probably end up sending them off to Fernando for uploading. I am now convinced that the strapwork around the hilt is indeed low-grade pewter and not lead as I initially thought. It is soft enough that I can slightly scratch it with my thumb nail, but where it has broken away from the wood grip, it is brittle and non-bendable. It's not white metal, but I guess it could still be some other alloy. Tin? I know tin-smithing was around then. Have to do more research. I still think it's a contstant for early American, but also Span colonial. Last edited by M ELEY; 19th November 2009 at 03:18 PM.

19th November 2009, 06:02 PM	#2
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,158	Trying again... Attached Images

19th November 2009, 06:08 PM	#3
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,158	More pics... Attached Images

19th November 2009, 06:11 PM	#4
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,158	Thanks, Rick! That program you recommended was easy to use. I did it myself- gasp! Attached Images

19th November 2009, 06:58 PM	#7
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Just a quick thought....the metal 'spiral' could be a zinc alloy. Africans are masters of utilising any resource. They obtain the zinc alloy from the outer casing of dry cell batteries. (invented late 19th C). Bearing in mind many areas are fairly remote from electrical supplies, the use of batteries by colonalists was increasingly more widespread as the 20th C progressed. Discharged batteries were not re-chargeable and discarded. A fairly similar sword from Africa http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=toureg Regards David . Attached Images

19th November 2009, 06:19 PM	#5
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,158	The sword measures just under 22" long with a 17" blade, so I guess it could be either a short hanger or long dagger. As already stated, the interesting wood grip cut with grooves with metal strapwork (damaged on one side). The alloy isn't white metal, silver, or lead (not soft enough). It could be tin or pewter (I suspect the latter). Note the small hole in the quillon, possibly for a chain link or knot? So...what is it? Euro hanger, colonial piece, Spanish espada? Dagger or sword? Late 18th, early or mid-19th? Thanks all.

19th November 2009, 06:24 PM	#6
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Hi I would not rule out Africa......there are a number of similar swords originating from West Africa.....Although I have not seen one with the 'spiral' decorated hilt. All the best David

19th November 2009, 06:18 PM	#8
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Hi M Eley , well done Having loads of teenagers around I had to learn quickly...to save face Hope you don't mind ..I have re-edited your picture and reposted. I'm lucky, I have a photo editor which is easy to use. All the best David Ah dear......since writing this post.......loads more pictures have been posted You have obviously mastered it now . Attached Images