Could the eyelash mark originate from Vienna ?

Jim McDougall · 27th October 2009, 02:25 AM

Hi Gonzalo,
Thank you very much for your very clearly well thought out and eloquently worded comments in response to my posts and comments. There is absolutely no need to apoligize for any delays in response as I am well aware of your circumstances in computer access and admire your tenacity in your efforts.
Actually I dont believe there is, as you note, anything disrespectful about polemic approaches to any presented opinions or discussion reviewing stated material on any topic. I completely agree that the venerable scholars that have provided the benchmarks for our pursuits in the serious study of historic weapons and thier development should be admired and respected. Further, it is clear that, as you well put, new research often reveals that previously held views are sometimes proven incorrect.

Simply put, I agree that it is good to question theories, hypothesis or observations in discussion in order to reaffirm thier validity and the elements of evidence in support of them. Conversely, if questions are presented, they too should be supported by evidence that constructively offers some proof that these are somehow of questionable validity.

Certainly you have noted some comments I have made that perhaps may have been better worded, such as my note regarding the work of highly respected scholars as 'well documented evidence'. I agree that academically I should not hold these works as 'evidence', however, at a personal level, and having known a number of these men at that level, you can understand how respect might dictate such thoughts. I am sure that the late Mr. Norman, who was indeed one of them, would welcome such documented information to correct any errors in his work.

I believe that we here are all interested in advancing our knowledge on the history and development of arms and armour, and I am ever amazed at the wonderful weapons, material and observations presented here. I honestly welcome all entries in discussion, but prefer to remain on topic in constructively developing information that better helps us in evaluating evidence and observations.

I return your kind comments regarding my posts and will say that your input here is equally helpful to myself and others, and as always, the object is to learn together, as you know. It is perfectly acceptable, and indeed expected, for there to be some degree of dispute in discussions or debates. What is important is that here we are gentlemen, as you clearly represent, and proceed accordingly to continue advancing our ever growing base of knowledge.

All very best regards,
Jim

P.S. LOL!! Save me a spot there in the Cambridge Library!!! I think I need to be there too!!

Gonzalo G · 27th October 2009, 08:06 AM

Jim, thank you very much for your kind words and your understanding. And though I am not good in making some stetements, as I am too direct, I will try to be of some use with my modest participations.
My best regards

Gonzalo

fernando · 27th November 2009, 04:59 PM

Hi David,
I was having a look to threads in line with the 'eyelash' mark, and i noticed that, in your first post, the mark shown is called in italian 'seghetti', which means 'hacksaw'.
Could this be the consensual name of the 'eyelash' mark in Italy?
Interesting.
Fernando

katana · 28th November 2009, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fernando

Hi David,
I was having a look to threads in line with the 'eyelash' mark, and i noticed that, in your first post, the mark shown is called in italian 'seghetti', which means 'hacksaw'.
Could this be the consensual name of the 'eyelash' mark in Italy?
Interesting.
Fernando

Hi Fernando

,
interesting indeed.......when searching 'seghetti' on google images you get different 'saws' not just the hacksaw. In fact, some of the saws are 'seghetto' (the plural term ?).
I personally feel that the 'eyelash' mark is a 'picturial symbol' (teeth of a saw) for the blades cutting abillity / quality. It seems that the eyelash mark occurs/originates on early, quality Italian blades.Perhaps 'seghetti' is the 'correct' and original name for the 'eyelash' mark and the 'root' / origin of this Italian word will help to explain the mark.
Hopefully one of our Italian formites may have more information.

All the best Fernando

David

Marcus · 29th August 2016, 01:23 PM

On this Moroccan s'boula, the “eyelashes” (or are they crescent moons?) do not appear in pairs or with other elaborations. Do they have talismanic significance or were they intended to imply European provenance?

corrado26 · 29th August 2016, 02:34 PM

An interesting description of this "eyelash"-mark is to be found in the catalogue of the Wallace Collection - European Arms and Armour. Here this mark is called "sickle-mark". I saw this mark very often of blades signed with "FRINGIA".
corrado26

29th August 2016, 01:23 PM	#5
Marcus Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 420	Unusual eyelashes? On this Moroccan s'boula, the “eyelashes” (or are they crescent moons?) do not appear in pairs or with other elaborations. Do they have talismanic significance or were they intended to imply European provenance? Attached Images

29th August 2016, 02:34 PM	#6
corrado26 Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Black Forest, Germany Posts: 1,226	An interesting description of this "eyelash"-mark is to be found in the catalogue of the Wallace Collection - European Arms and Armour. Here this mark is called "sickle-mark". I saw this mark very often of blades signed with "FRINGIA". corrado26 Attached Images

27th October 2009, 02:25 AM	#1
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,192	Hi Gonzalo, Thank you very much for your very clearly well thought out and eloquently worded comments in response to my posts and comments. There is absolutely no need to apoligize for any delays in response as I am well aware of your circumstances in computer access and admire your tenacity in your efforts. Actually I dont believe there is, as you note, anything disrespectful about polemic approaches to any presented opinions or discussion reviewing stated material on any topic. I completely agree that the venerable scholars that have provided the benchmarks for our pursuits in the serious study of historic weapons and thier development should be admired and respected. Further, it is clear that, as you well put, new research often reveals that previously held views are sometimes proven incorrect. Simply put, I agree that it is good to question theories, hypothesis or observations in discussion in order to reaffirm thier validity and the elements of evidence in support of them. Conversely, if questions are presented, they too should be supported by evidence that constructively offers some proof that these are somehow of questionable validity. Certainly you have noted some comments I have made that perhaps may have been better worded, such as my note regarding the work of highly respected scholars as 'well documented evidence'. I agree that academically I should not hold these works as 'evidence', however, at a personal level, and having known a number of these men at that level, you can understand how respect might dictate such thoughts. I am sure that the late Mr. Norman, who was indeed one of them, would welcome such documented information to correct any errors in his work. I believe that we here are all interested in advancing our knowledge on the history and development of arms and armour, and I am ever amazed at the wonderful weapons, material and observations presented here. I honestly welcome all entries in discussion, but prefer to remain on topic in constructively developing information that better helps us in evaluating evidence and observations. I return your kind comments regarding my posts and will say that your input here is equally helpful to myself and others, and as always, the object is to learn together, as you know. It is perfectly acceptable, and indeed expected, for there to be some degree of dispute in discussions or debates. What is important is that here we are gentlemen, as you clearly represent, and proceed accordingly to continue advancing our ever growing base of knowledge. All very best regards, Jim P.S. LOL!! Save me a spot there in the Cambridge Library!!! I think I need to be there too!!

27th October 2009, 08:06 AM	#2
Gonzalo G Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Nothern Mexico Posts: 458	Jim, thank you very much for your kind words and your understanding. And though I am not good in making some stetements, as I am too direct, I will try to be of some use with my modest participations. My best regards Gonzalo

27th November 2009, 04:59 PM	#3
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Hi David, I was having a look to threads in line with the 'eyelash' mark, and i noticed that, in your first post, the mark shown is called in italian 'seghetti', which means 'hacksaw'. Could this be the consensual name of the 'eyelash' mark in Italy? Interesting. Fernando