High-resolution pics at Cornell's website

VANDOO · 11th July 2009, 05:53 AM

THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION
I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO CALL IT A WAR MEMORIAL OR SOMETHING ELSE.
IF IT WAS DONE BY THE AMERICANS IT WOULD NOT BE A WAR MEMORIAL BUT IF THE MORO DID IT PERHAPS IT WAS A MEMORIAL TO THEIR FALLEN BROTHERS?
YOUR REFRENCES POINT OUT THAT IT WAS NOT DONE BECAUSE OF TRIBAL TRADITION BUT AS A RESULT OF A TERRIBLE BATTLE AND GREAT LOSS OF LIFE. BUT THE WHY IT WAS DONE AND BY WHO IS PERHAPS A MYSTERY.

IF WHAT WE SEE IS A RESULT OF THE AMERICANS CLEANING UP THE AREA I DON'T THINK THEY DID A PROPER OR RESPECTFUL JOB OF IT UNLESS THEY DID IT TO SERVE AS A WARNING TO THE MORO IN THE AREA

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A GOOD WAR BUT UNFORTUNATELY UNTIL MAN CHANGES A LOT IT WILL ALWAYS BE AROUND.

IN BORNEO THE SKULLS WERE KEPT HANGING IN THE LONGHOUSE, IN NEW GUINEA THEY WERE KEPT IN SKULL RACKS OR HANGING IN THE HOUSE, LOTS OF OTHER PLACES THEY WERE KEPT AROUND THE FRONT OR SIDES OF THE HOUSE. AZTEC'S IN AMERICA HAD MASSIVE SKULL RACKS SOME FOR SACRIFICIAL VICTIMS AND OTHERS FOR THE SKULLS OF THE BEST PLAYER IN THEIR BALL GAMES. THE PICTURE MADE ME AWARE THAT I KNOW THERE WAS HEADHUNTING IN THE PHILIPPINES BUT DON'T KNOW HOW OR WHERE THEY KEPT THEIR SKULLS? A MORBID QUESTION PERHAPS BUT IT WAS A PART OF THEIR CULTURE.

migueldiaz · 11th July 2009, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dimasalang

I stand corrected! Thanks Miguel for clearing that up!

OT: Dimasalang, in your past visits to the Phils., have you had the chance to visit Museo ng Rebolusyon [Museum of the Revolution] in Pinaglabanan? Haven't been there but I'm planning to, so I can post pics here later ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by VANDOO

... IF WHAT WE SEE IS A RESULT OF THE AMERICANS CLEANING UP THE AREA I DON'T THINK THEY DID A PROPER OR RESPECTFUL JOB OF IT UNLESS THEY DID IT TO SERVE AS A WARNING TO THE MORO IN THE AREA

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A GOOD WAR BUT UNFORTUNATELY UNTIL MAN CHANGES A LOT IT WILL ALWAYS BE AROUND.

...

Thanks Vandoo for the comments.

On the politics of warfare (and still referring to Fulton's chapters on Bud Dajo), we find this [April 1906] conversation between General Leonard Wood and the Sulu headmen:

"... the Sultan observed, 'There are very few people in Jolo [Sulu], and if a fight like that [i.e., Bud Dajo] occurs many times there will be no more people left in Jolo.' The Sultan then begged Wood to, in the future, let the Jolo leadership rather than American soldiers mount any such operations against the insurgents. Wood ridiculed the idea and badgered the Sultan to admit that if they had tried to take Bud Dajo, 'it would have finished all the Moros in the attacking party ... there would only monkeys be left to live in Jolo ... A great many of our people believe that all men are descended from monkeys, and they might eventually have produced another race here.' But the Sultan turned the tables, responding, 'It is more likely that human beings become monkeys, than monkeys turn into human beings.' "

Warfare is a messy business indeed.

I'll post next pics of olden Filipino headhunters displaying their skull trophies.

migueldiaz · 11th July 2009, 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VANDOO

THE PICTURE MADE ME AWARE THAT I KNOW THERE WAS HEADHUNTING IN THE PHILIPPINES BUT DON'T KNOW HOW OR WHERE THEY KEPT THEIR SKULLS? A MORBID QUESTION PERHAPS BUT IT WAS A PART OF THEIR CULTURE.

Amongst Phil. ethnic groups, the ones I know who displayed human skulls as trophies would be the Igorots.

We've seen the pics below before, but these are clearer copies (coming from that Cornell website).

Note also that human jawbones of headhunting victims also find another use!

migueldiaz · 11th July 2009, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VANDOO

IN BORNEO THE SKULLS WERE KEPT HANGING IN THE LONGHOUSE, IN NEW GUINEA THEY WERE KEPT IN SKULL RACKS OR HANGING IN THE HOUSE, LOTS OF OTHER PLACES THEY WERE KEPT AROUND THE FRONT OR SIDES OF THE HOUSE. AZTEC'S IN AMERICA HAD MASSIVE SKULL RACKS SOME FOR SACRIFICIAL VICTIMS AND OTHERS FOR THE SKULLS OF THE BEST PLAYER IN THEIR BALL GAMES. THE PICTURE MADE ME AWARE THAT I KNOW THERE WAS HEADHUNTING IN THE PHILIPPINES BUT DON'T KNOW HOW OR WHERE THEY KEPT THEIR SKULLS? A MORBID QUESTION PERHAPS BUT IT WAS A PART OF THEIR CULTURE.

Vandoo, below is the text pertaining to the drawing above of a Tinguian headhunters' feast.

Nonoy, is this true that the Tingguians mix the mashed brain with the local wine, and that the skulls were crushed and the pieces given to friends as gifts?

The scene looks like it's straight from a "B" movie

so I'm just wondering whether it was a faithful account of an old practice ...

Rick · 11th July 2009, 02:17 PM

I'm surprised they didn't have a problem with Laughing Sickness in a tribe with such a ritual ..

11th July 2009, 05:53 AM	#1
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO CALL IT A WAR MEMORIAL OR SOMETHING ELSE. IF IT WAS DONE BY THE AMERICANS IT WOULD NOT BE A WAR MEMORIAL BUT IF THE MORO DID IT PERHAPS IT WAS A MEMORIAL TO THEIR FALLEN BROTHERS? YOUR REFRENCES POINT OUT THAT IT WAS NOT DONE BECAUSE OF TRIBAL TRADITION BUT AS A RESULT OF A TERRIBLE BATTLE AND GREAT LOSS OF LIFE. BUT THE WHY IT WAS DONE AND BY WHO IS PERHAPS A MYSTERY. IF WHAT WE SEE IS A RESULT OF THE AMERICANS CLEANING UP THE AREA I DON'T THINK THEY DID A PROPER OR RESPECTFUL JOB OF IT UNLESS THEY DID IT TO SERVE AS A WARNING TO THE MORO IN THE AREA THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A GOOD WAR BUT UNFORTUNATELY UNTIL MAN CHANGES A LOT IT WILL ALWAYS BE AROUND. IN BORNEO THE SKULLS WERE KEPT HANGING IN THE LONGHOUSE, IN NEW GUINEA THEY WERE KEPT IN SKULL RACKS OR HANGING IN THE HOUSE, LOTS OF OTHER PLACES THEY WERE KEPT AROUND THE FRONT OR SIDES OF THE HOUSE. AZTEC'S IN AMERICA HAD MASSIVE SKULL RACKS SOME FOR SACRIFICIAL VICTIMS AND OTHERS FOR THE SKULLS OF THE BEST PLAYER IN THEIR BALL GAMES. THE PICTURE MADE ME AWARE THAT I KNOW THERE WAS HEADHUNTING IN THE PHILIPPINES BUT DON'T KNOW HOW OR WHERE THEY KEPT THEIR SKULLS? A MORBID QUESTION PERHAPS BUT IT WAS A PART OF THEIR CULTURE.

11th July 2009, 02:17 PM	#5
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,336	I'm surprised they didn't have a problem with Laughing Sickness in a tribe with such a ritual ..