Unusual lock for ID

[celtan]

Hi Philip,

Would you kindlyshow us a couple Madrid Lock's illustrations from the book you mention?

Best

Manolo

Originally Posted by Philip

Fernando,
An interesting gun! The mechanism appears to be a version of the so-called "Madrid lock", developed in Spain sometime in the 18th cent. It was intended to be a hybrid of the Iberian "patilha" locks (with the sear which engages the hammer or cock through apertures in the lockplate) and the familiar "French" flintlock (with its internal mainspring acting on a tumbler upon whose axis the cock pivots). The shape of the lockplate and the cock are patterned after the French lock. James D. Lavin, in his classic work A HISTORY OF SPANISH FIREARMS (1965), discusses this in some detail. These locks achieved limited popularity in Spain, and as far as I have been able to determine they were not imitated in the Near East as were the "patilha" and "agujeta" mechanisms. You mainly see them on Spanish military-pattern muskets.

This is the first percussion example that I'm aware of. The outline of the lockplate, so similar to that of a flintlock, gives the impression of an original flint mechanism which may have been converted to percussion via a change from cock to hammer, and the removal of the priming-pan, the frizzen and its pivot screw, and the frizzen spring and screw. However, this must be verified by a closer examination of the metal in the lockplate. A conversion would have necessitated the filling-in of the holes for the frizzen pivot screw, and the frizzen spring screw and retaining teat.

Howard L. Blackmore, in GUNS AND RIFLES OF THE WORLD (1965) also discusses Madrid locks, providing an operational diagram of one specimen, and providing photos of 4 examples (figs. 264-67) which indicate that there were variations in the locations of the half- and full-cock sears. But the essential features (the two principles enumerated at the beginning of this post) are the same.

[Philip]

Hi, Celtan
I'll see what I can do re: pics. Buying a scanner has been on my "to do" list for 2+ years, but everytime I make up my mind to go to the store, a sword, gun, or a tool for my workshop is offered to me that I can't do without! Will try using my dig camera on Blackmore's book; sorry I don't own a copy of Lavin (though I've used library copies over the years).

[celtan]

I understand you perfectly, a camera's pic will do fine. It's just I have never seen one in its flintlock version. I sure could use the image to illustrate the model, on lectures I offer on the subject.

Best regards, and thanks for taking the time to answer.

Manolo

Manuel Luis Iravedra

Originally Posted by Philip

Hi, Celtan
I'll see what I can do re: pics. Buying a scanner has been on my "to do" list for 2+ years, but everytime I make up my mind to go to the store, a sword, gun, or a tool for my workshop is offered to me that I can't do without! Will try using my dig camera on Blackmore's book; sorry I don't own a copy of Lavin (though I've used library copies over the years).

[fernando]

Hi Manolo,
I am not sure what you want to see; i will try and be usefull.
I happen to have Lavin's work.
On what touches the connection with my lock example, this sketch represents what he calls infrequent version, as far as the cocking device is concerned.
Obviously at this stage the rest of the lock was the type with the external main spring and the flintlock hammer, whereas mine, with a percussion hammer and the internal springs, together with that 'advanced' sear retracting system, is a later evolution which i haven't yet seen illustrated out there; but i keep looking, though.

Fernando.

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[fernando]

Everyone knows the basic system, right ?

Fernando

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