War Shillelagh

Tim Simmons · 4th March 2009, 06:21 PM

I think clubs have been a weapon of choise for centuries worldwide and great skills develped in there use, either one or two handed long before any colonial surpression. If you are slow with your blade a fast club will take you out just as easy. Not primitive in any way. ouch!!!

VANDOO · 4th March 2009, 06:54 PM

I WOULD IMAGINE DUE TO THE SCARICTY OF FOOD AMONG THE POOR IN IRELAND. THEY OFTEN USED CLUBS FOR HUNTING AS WELL AS FIGHTING. THE POOR DIDN'T OWN THE LAND AND WERE OFTEN FORBIDDEN ON PAIN OF DEATH TO HUNT OR POACH ANY GAME. SO I SUSPECT THERE WERE SMALLER HUNTING CLUBS FOR THROWING AT SMALL GAME AS WELL AS THE LARGER CLUBS. THAT HAS USUALLY BEEN THE CASE IN MANY SOCIETYS I AM MORE FAMILIAR WITH THAN IRELAND. THE ADVANTAGES WERE THERE WAS LITTLE COST AS YOU USUALLY MADE YOUR OWN, THE LORDS DIDN'T CARE IF YOU HAD THEM, AND A THROWN CLUB DIDN'T MAKE ANY NOISE WHEN YOU POACHED SMALL GAME. I SUSPECT THE MEN ALSO HAD SOME COMPETICIAN AND GAMES TO SHOW OFF THEIR SKILL AT THROWING. THIS IS ALL A GUESS AS I HAVE NOT STUDIED THE COUNTRY AND PEOPLE OF IRELAND.
I GUESS THE SCOTTS WANTED TO SHOW OFF SO INSTEAD OF THROWING A WEE CLUB THEY THROW THE CABER.

Jim McDougall · 4th March 2009, 07:26 PM

Thanks Tim for joining in on this, and you're right, it seems that in many a pinch, a baseball bat or pool cue surely took care of business!
BTW, it seems that the stick or cudgel often served in training soldiers in broadsword or sabre movements, seemingly in the manner of kendo in Japanese martial arts (though I realize that in the same way these developed into thier own form of martial arts beyond training exercises).

I'm glad to see you on this also Barry! our local club maven!
Absolutely well noted on the economic perspective of these times and places, and as for the Scots....when you got bopped with a caper.....you knew it!!

Roosevelt said it best, with a big stick, you can walk wherever and however you want!!

or something like that.

All the best,
Jim

Lew · 4th March 2009, 10:31 PM

Yes clubs are quite effective and a heavy well made one can break and crush bones even if you get hit in the arms,legs or any part of the torso the are not just head bangers as many people think. Clubs come in all shapes and sizes and are really fun to collect they are one of my favorite weapons.

Here is one that was used for personal protection by an American geologist during the 1920s-30s in Rhodesia while mining for copper.

Lew

Jim McDougall · 5th March 2009, 12:24 AM

Lew, you always come up with really neat weapons!!! and it seems with intriguing provenance that adds great dimension. Great visuals thinking of what must have been high adventure in those days.

Just though of another discussion not too long ago about the well known police truncheons or 'billy clubs'.

Best regards,
Jim

RomaRana · 5th March 2009, 08:00 PM

Just a side note. The real Monk was actually named Monk Eastman. He was a turn of the century (1900) Jewish gang leader on the Lower East Side.

David · 5th March 2009, 08:27 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monk_Eastman

Jim McDougall · 5th March 2009, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RomaRana

Just a side note. The real Monk was actually named Monk Eastman. He was a turn of the century (1900) Jewish gang leader on the Lower East Side.

Now THAT'S interesting!! and wonder if he got the idea of notching the club from the dime novel boys writing on gunfighters, or if the idea was his own form of psychological warfare.
Along these lines comes to mind Buford Pusser, the southern sheriff in "Walking Tall".

Best regards,
Jim

4th March 2009, 10:31 PM	#4
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	Yes clubs are quite effective and a heavy well made one can break and crush bones even if you get hit in the arms,legs or any part of the torso the are not just head bangers as many people think. Clubs come in all shapes and sizes and are really fun to collect they are one of my favorite weapons. Here is one that was used for personal protection by an American geologist during the 1920s-30s in Rhodesia while mining for copper. Lew Attached Images

4th March 2009, 06:21 PM	#1
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,855	I think clubs have been a weapon of choise for centuries worldwide and great skills develped in there use, either one or two handed long before any colonial surpression. If you are slow with your blade a fast club will take you out just as easy. Not primitive in any way. ouch!!!

4th March 2009, 06:54 PM	#2
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	I WOULD IMAGINE DUE TO THE SCARICTY OF FOOD AMONG THE POOR IN IRELAND. THEY OFTEN USED CLUBS FOR HUNTING AS WELL AS FIGHTING. THE POOR DIDN'T OWN THE LAND AND WERE OFTEN FORBIDDEN ON PAIN OF DEATH TO HUNT OR POACH ANY GAME. SO I SUSPECT THERE WERE SMALLER HUNTING CLUBS FOR THROWING AT SMALL GAME AS WELL AS THE LARGER CLUBS. THAT HAS USUALLY BEEN THE CASE IN MANY SOCIETYS I AM MORE FAMILIAR WITH THAN IRELAND. THE ADVANTAGES WERE THERE WAS LITTLE COST AS YOU USUALLY MADE YOUR OWN, THE LORDS DIDN'T CARE IF YOU HAD THEM, AND A THROWN CLUB DIDN'T MAKE ANY NOISE WHEN YOU POACHED SMALL GAME. I SUSPECT THE MEN ALSO HAD SOME COMPETICIAN AND GAMES TO SHOW OFF THEIR SKILL AT THROWING. THIS IS ALL A GUESS AS I HAVE NOT STUDIED THE COUNTRY AND PEOPLE OF IRELAND. I GUESS THE SCOTTS WANTED TO SHOW OFF SO INSTEAD OF THROWING A WEE CLUB THEY THROW THE CABER.

4th March 2009, 07:26 PM	#3
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,281	Thanks Tim for joining in on this, and you're right, it seems that in many a pinch, a baseball bat or pool cue surely took care of business! BTW, it seems that the stick or cudgel often served in training soldiers in broadsword or sabre movements, seemingly in the manner of kendo in Japanese martial arts (though I realize that in the same way these developed into thier own form of martial arts beyond training exercises). I'm glad to see you on this also Barry! our local club maven! Absolutely well noted on the economic perspective of these times and places, and as for the Scots....when you got bopped with a caper.....you knew it!! Roosevelt said it best, with a big stick, you can walk wherever and however you want!! or something like that. All the best, Jim

5th March 2009, 12:24 AM	#5
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,281	Lew, you always come up with really neat weapons!!! and it seems with intriguing provenance that adds great dimension. Great visuals thinking of what must have been high adventure in those days. Just though of another discussion not too long ago about the well known police truncheons or 'billy clubs'. Best regards, Jim

5th March 2009, 08:00 PM	#6
RomaRana Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 58	Just a side note. The real Monk was actually named Monk Eastman. He was a turn of the century (1900) Jewish gang leader on the Lower East Side.

5th March 2009, 08:27 PM	#7
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,218	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monk_Eastman