Gunong?

tom hyle · 21st April 2005, 11:46 AM

Late on the old forum: "mysteries, projects, etc." Octagon handle with same type pommel we've recently seen on a (batless/simplified variant) bathead-type parang nabur, and a horn crossguard, but tang is full length....

Battara · 21st April 2005, 06:54 PM

I'm thinking WWII gunong, but this is a type I have not seen much of.

Federico · 22nd April 2005, 12:49 AM

Spunjer is the blade hardened? I have a piece with a similar hilt and guard, but the balde is junk. Features aluminum bands on the scabbard. MOP may indicate WWII era.

Spunjer · 23rd April 2005, 12:37 PM

federico,
yes the blade is hardened. this came from the collection of someone by the named of marcel gibrat, who was an art restorer for the Metropolitan Museum of Art from 1957 to 1965. i don't if any of you are familiar with that name. btw, is MOP a dead giveaway for a mid 20th cent. filipino weapon? i'm not just talking about this gunong, but other weapons such as moro and visayan stuff as well. just curious...

Ian · 23rd April 2005, 12:50 PM

Spunjer:

MOP may have been used earlier than WWII on scabbards, but I have not seen a convincing example. Perhaps others have.

Ian.

tom hyle · 23rd April 2005, 03:19 PM

It seems like one sees it on older kris sundang and barong scabbards? It's certainly not the MOP per se that I for my part was citing as Visayan-looking nor as modern, but the manner in which it is worked, in the pointy shapes with jagged edges.

Federico · 23rd April 2005, 10:04 PM

MOP is like any other dating feature/guess, it is not complete on its own, but can provide a hint. There are definitely swords pre-WWII from all over PI that feature MOP. I have seen some on scabbards from the 30s (notably talibong/garab/ok I forgot the last newest term for these weapons being bandied about), and earlier. But what sets apart the older use of MOP, at least in those piece that I have encountered, has been the usage. Usually alot more sparingly, and not as prolific as post WWII pieces. Hence the maybe part in my earlier comment. Its presence may indicate WWII era or later, but it is sparing enough in its usage where it could be older. I dunno, thats just how I feel about it, never feel certain, and Im usually just guessing and spouting stuff out my behind (ooh killing my own credibility here). You can always do what I normally do at home, hold the piece, and let it decide for itself what age it is and where its from. Not an exact science, ok not a science or methodology at all, but it helps me sleep at night in lieu of burning questions

21st April 2005, 11:46 AM	#1
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	Late on the old forum: "mysteries, projects, etc." Octagon handle with same type pommel we've recently seen on a (batless/simplified variant) bathead-type parang nabur, and a horn crossguard, but tang is full length....

21st April 2005, 06:54 PM	#2
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,272	I'm thinking WWII gunong, but this is a type I have not seen much of.

22nd April 2005, 12:49 AM	#3
Federico Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Minneapolis, MN, USA Posts: 312	Spunjer is the blade hardened? I have a piece with a similar hilt and guard, but the balde is junk. Features aluminum bands on the scabbard. MOP may indicate WWII era.

23rd April 2005, 12:37 PM	#4
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	federico, yes the blade is hardened. this came from the collection of someone by the named of marcel gibrat, who was an art restorer for the Metropolitan Museum of Art from 1957 to 1965. i don't if any of you are familiar with that name. btw, is MOP a dead giveaway for a mid 20th cent. filipino weapon? i'm not just talking about this gunong, but other weapons such as moro and visayan stuff as well. just curious...

23rd April 2005, 12:50 PM	#5
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,363	Spunjer: MOP may have been used earlier than WWII on scabbards, but I have not seen a convincing example. Perhaps others have. Ian.

23rd April 2005, 03:19 PM	#6
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	It seems like one sees it on older kris sundang and barong scabbards? It's certainly not the MOP per se that I for my part was citing as Visayan-looking nor as modern, but the manner in which it is worked, in the pointy shapes with jagged edges.

23rd April 2005, 10:04 PM	#7
Federico Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Minneapolis, MN, USA Posts: 312	MOP is like any other dating feature/guess, it is not complete on its own, but can provide a hint. There are definitely swords pre-WWII from all over PI that feature MOP. I have seen some on scabbards from the 30s (notably talibong/garab/ok I forgot the last newest term for these weapons being bandied about), and earlier. But what sets apart the older use of MOP, at least in those piece that I have encountered, has been the usage. Usually alot more sparingly, and not as prolific as post WWII pieces. Hence the maybe part in my earlier comment. Its presence may indicate WWII era or later, but it is sparing enough in its usage where it could be older. I dunno, thats just how I feel about it, never feel certain, and Im usually just guessing and spouting stuff out my behind (ooh killing my own credibility here). You can always do what I normally do at home, hold the piece, and let it decide for itself what age it is and where its from. Not an exact science, ok not a science or methodology at all, but it helps me sleep at night in lieu of burning questions