PARMOR SPEAR BLADE FROM CERAM IS.

VANDOO · 6th February 2009, 07:19 PM

HERE IS A OLD PARMOR SPEAR BLADE I BOUGHT ON AMBON ISLAND IN THE MOLUCCAS (SPICE ISLANDS) IN 1993. IT WAS SAID TO HAVE BELONGED TO A RAJAH (CHIEF) ON CERAM (SERAM) ISLAND OF THE NAULU PEOPLE.
IT IS A PARMOR BLADE 21.5 INCHES LONG AND HAS A ROUGH FINISH IT LOOKS MORE LIKE A POLE ARM THAN A SPEAR AND IS HEAVY AND WELL MADE AND APPEARS TO HAVE BEEN CLEANED BUT NOT ETCHED SO THE PATTERN DOESN'T SHOW UP.
I DID NOT HAVE MUCH LUCK FINDING GOOD OLD EDGED WEAPONS IN THOSE ISLANDS BUT DID SEE 3 OF THE OLD ALL PARMOR STEEL KERIS FOR SALE I SHOULD HAVE BOUGHT THEM, BUT RAN OUT OF TIME AND DIDN'T GET BACK TO THEM. I VISITED CERAM AND A NAULU VILLAGE THERE AND SAW SOME OF THE RECENT PARANGS, SPEARS, SHIELDS AND BOWS AND ARROWS CURRENTLY IN USE. I ALSO VISITED SAPARUA ISLAND AND DID SOME HIKEING THERE.

David · 6th February 2009, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VANDOO

HERE IS A OLD PARMOR SPEAR BLADE I BOUGHT ON AMBON ISLAND IN THE MOLUCCAS (SPICE ISLANDS) IN 1993. IT WAS SAID TO HAVE BELONGED TO A RAJAH (CHIEF) ON CERAM (SERAM) ISLAND OF THE NAULU PEOPLE.
IT IS A PARMOR BLADE 21.5 INCHES LONG AND HAS A ROUGH FINISH IT LOOKS MORE LIKE A POLE ARM THAN A SPEAR AND IS HEAVY AND WELL MADE AND APPEARS TO HAVE BEEN CLEANED BUT NOT ETCHED SO THE PATTERN DOESN'T SHOW UP.
I DID NOT HAVE MUCH LUCK FINDING GOOD OLD EDGED WEAPONS IN THOSE ISLANDS BUT DID SEE 3 OF THE OLD ALL PARMOR STEEL KERIS FOR SALE I SHOULD HAVE BOUGHT THEM, BUT RAN OUT OF TIME AND DIDN'T GET BACK TO THEM. I VISITED CERAM AND A NAULU VILLAGE THERE AND SAW SOME OF THE RECENT PARANGS, SPEARS, SHIELDS AND BOWS AND ARROWS CURRENTLY IN USE. I ALSO VISITED SAPARUA ISLAND AND DID SOME HIKEING THERE.

Hi Barry. Not trying to be a wise guy, but do you mean "pamor" or is "parmor" something different.

VANDOO · 7th February 2009, 01:26 AM

IT WAS MUCH SIMPLER IN THE OLD DAYS WE JUST CALLED IT A METEOR IRON BLADE.

IT IS MADE LIKE AN OLD KERIS BLADE AND HAS THE ROUGH TEXTURE AND PATTERNS LIKE KERIS BLADES, THAT IS WHAT I MENT BY PARMOR.
THE MORE SIMPLE FOLDED PATTERNS IN BLADES THAT ARE SMOOTH ON THE SURFACE USED TO BE REFERED TO AS WATERED STEEL BLADES. THE WATERED STEEL BLADES WERE COMMON ON OLD PHILIPPINE SWORDS AS WELL AS SOME FROM MALAYSIA AND INDONESIA. THESE DAYS THEY ARE REFERRED TO AS PATTERNED STEEL, DAMASCAS AND WOOTZ AMONG OTHER THINGS, I STILL PERFER WATERED STEEL. TO ME TRUE WOOTZ IS MOSTLY FOUND ONLY ON INDO- PERSIAN AND ARABIC WEAPONS BUT I AM OLD FASHONED AND NOT AN EXPERT IN MUCH JUST A JACK OF ALL TRADES.

David · 7th February 2009, 03:06 PM

Yep, that would be "pamor" then.

Of course, when we called these "meteor iron" we were dead wrong 99.9% of the time and only perpetuating a myth, so i am not so sorry to see that fall by the wayside.

All that aside this is a very interest spearhead. Would love to see what it looks like cleaned up and re-stained.

Sajen · 7th February 2009, 04:37 PM

Very interesting item!
Detlef

VANDOO · 24th February 2009, 06:10 PM

I HAVE STILL BEEN LOOKING FOR ITEMS SIMULAR TO THIS , SO FAR ON PAGE 89 OF (TRADITIONAL WEAPONS OF THE INDONESIAN ARCHIPELAGO) THERE IS AN ITEM CALLED A MUNDO WHICH HAS SOME SIMULARITYS. IT IS FROM SUMATRA NOT THE MOLUCCAS AND IS A KNIFE OR SWORD

NO WAY TO TELL AS THE SIZE IS NOT GIVEN. I THINK MY EXAMPLE IS MOST LIKELY A POLE ARM OR SPEAR POINT BECAUSE OF THE BLOSTER AND THE LONG TANG. I WILL KEEP LOOKING THRU WHAT REFRENCES I HAVE AND WOULD APPRECIATE IT IF ANYONE ELSE HAS THE TIME AND REFRENCES TO SEE WHAT THEY CAN FIND. THANKS IN ADVANCE.

KuKulzA28 · 24th February 2009, 06:23 PM

In shape/geometry, it resembles a Chinese "Guan Dao".
Here is a picture for those who don't know what I am talking about.

Therefore it may be a clue as to it's use? From it's design, it seems best for heavy hacking like a Guan Dao or a Naginata - polearm.

6th February 2009, 07:19 PM	#1
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	PARMOR SPEAR BLADE FROM CERAM IS. HERE IS A OLD PARMOR SPEAR BLADE I BOUGHT ON AMBON ISLAND IN THE MOLUCCAS (SPICE ISLANDS) IN 1993. IT WAS SAID TO HAVE BELONGED TO A RAJAH (CHIEF) ON CERAM (SERAM) ISLAND OF THE NAULU PEOPLE. IT IS A PARMOR BLADE 21.5 INCHES LONG AND HAS A ROUGH FINISH IT LOOKS MORE LIKE A POLE ARM THAN A SPEAR AND IS HEAVY AND WELL MADE AND APPEARS TO HAVE BEEN CLEANED BUT NOT ETCHED SO THE PATTERN DOESN'T SHOW UP. I DID NOT HAVE MUCH LUCK FINDING GOOD OLD EDGED WEAPONS IN THOSE ISLANDS BUT DID SEE 3 OF THE OLD ALL PARMOR STEEL KERIS FOR SALE I SHOULD HAVE BOUGHT THEM, BUT RAN OUT OF TIME AND DIDN'T GET BACK TO THEM. I VISITED CERAM AND A NAULU VILLAGE THERE AND SAW SOME OF THE RECENT PARANGS, SPEARS, SHIELDS AND BOWS AND ARROWS CURRENTLY IN USE. I ALSO VISITED SAPARUA ISLAND AND DID SOME HIKEING THERE. Attached Images

7th February 2009, 01:26 AM	#3
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	IT WAS MUCH SIMPLER IN THE OLD DAYS WE JUST CALLED IT A METEOR IRON BLADE. IT IS MADE LIKE AN OLD KERIS BLADE AND HAS THE ROUGH TEXTURE AND PATTERNS LIKE KERIS BLADES, THAT IS WHAT I MENT BY PARMOR. THE MORE SIMPLE FOLDED PATTERNS IN BLADES THAT ARE SMOOTH ON THE SURFACE USED TO BE REFERED TO AS WATERED STEEL BLADES. THE WATERED STEEL BLADES WERE COMMON ON OLD PHILIPPINE SWORDS AS WELL AS SOME FROM MALAYSIA AND INDONESIA. THESE DAYS THEY ARE REFERRED TO AS PATTERNED STEEL, DAMASCAS AND WOOTZ AMONG OTHER THINGS, I STILL PERFER WATERED STEEL. TO ME TRUE WOOTZ IS MOSTLY FOUND ONLY ON INDO- PERSIAN AND ARABIC WEAPONS BUT I AM OLD FASHONED AND NOT AN EXPERT IN MUCH JUST A JACK OF ALL TRADES.

7th February 2009, 03:06 PM	#4
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	Yep, that would be "pamor" then. Of course, when we called these "meteor iron" we were dead wrong 99.9% of the time and only perpetuating a myth, so i am not so sorry to see that fall by the wayside. All that aside this is a very interest spearhead. Would love to see what it looks like cleaned up and re-stained.

7th February 2009, 04:37 PM	#5
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,165	Very interesting item! Detlef

24th February 2009, 06:10 PM	#6
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	I HAVE STILL BEEN LOOKING FOR ITEMS SIMULAR TO THIS , SO FAR ON PAGE 89 OF (TRADITIONAL WEAPONS OF THE INDONESIAN ARCHIPELAGO) THERE IS AN ITEM CALLED A MUNDO WHICH HAS SOME SIMULARITYS. IT IS FROM SUMATRA NOT THE MOLUCCAS AND IS A KNIFE OR SWORD NO WAY TO TELL AS THE SIZE IS NOT GIVEN. I THINK MY EXAMPLE IS MOST LIKELY A POLE ARM OR SPEAR POINT BECAUSE OF THE BLOSTER AND THE LONG TANG. I WILL KEEP LOOKING THRU WHAT REFRENCES I HAVE AND WOULD APPRECIATE IT IF ANYONE ELSE HAS THE TIME AND REFRENCES TO SEE WHAT THEY CAN FIND. THANKS IN ADVANCE.

24th February 2009, 06:23 PM	#7
KuKulzA28 Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: between work and sleep Posts: 731	In shape/geometry, it resembles a Chinese "Guan Dao". Here is a picture for those who don't know what I am talking about. Therefore it may be a clue as to it's use? From it's design, it seems best for heavy hacking like a Guan Dao or a Naginata - polearm.