kaskara konundrum

[CharlesS]

Technically Lew, I would not call the blade from Oriental Arms a kirach. I don't think the point of the blade meets the qualifications.

I do, however, know exactly the type that you mean....long slender blade a tip that rather abruptly turns down instead of up. Some Indonesian swords are based on the same idea and similar blade profile.

[Lew]

Originally Posted by CharlesS

Technically Lew, I would not call the blade from Oriental Arms a kirach. I don't think the point of the blade meets the qualifications.

I do, however, know exactly the type that you mean....long slender blade a tip that rather abruptly turns down instead of up. Some Indonesian swords are based on the same idea and similar blade profile.

Charles

What would this be considered? Is the criteria that the point must be lower than the center axis of the blade? If you have a straight bladed tulwar and the point is at the center axis of the blade is it called something else?

Lew

[CharlesS]

Lew,

That one I would call a kirach. It has a lot more in common with the previously pictured khanda hilted example, primarily curvature, though very mild. On the other hand, the long sword(in my collection, btw) is simply a straight fighter....more along the lines of a stereotypical straight blade firingi, but in the case of the straight sword you have pictured, it's an Indian made blade from the Bikaneer armoury.

I think your observations about blade qualifications are well founded. I believe a kirach, along with the downcurve, generally has some degree of false edge....long or short..., which differentiates it from a sossun patah, again, in general. But, I have seen so many Indian blades that don't "follow the rules", I'd say there are exceptions to practically every "type".

[stephen wood]

...some more images of the hilt - is it sheet metal welded together rather than wrought? Also I think that there might have originally been a cap on the pommel

[katana]

Hi Stephen,
with the new pictures you've posted...I can see that the rivet does not pass through the blade.

Regards David

[ariel]

I am still voting "Sudanese'
No Indian ricasso ( not obligatory, but would help)
The fullers are narrow, shallow, rudimentary.
It just says Sudan to me.
In the absence of Indian markings , I see no reason to invent long journeys and "first example". Occam's razor say local.
Elgood presented Indian sword with a Piso-like handle, and let's not forget Gulabhati " khanda" handle on Sumatran peudeungs. Sure, Indians traveled to Indonesia and brought with them not only weapons but a whole culture/religion.
Nice to be able to be contrarian: some other Forums ( Fora???) would have expelled me long ago :-)

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by ariel

I am still voting "Sudanese'
No Indian ricasso ( not obligatory, but would help)
The fullers are narrow, shallow, rudimentary.
It just says Sudan to me.
In the absence of Indian markings , I see no reason to invent long journeys and "first example". Occam's razor say local.
Elgood presented Indian sword with a Piso-like handle, and let's not forget Gulabhati " khanda" handle on Sumatran peudeungs. Sure, Indians traveled to Indonesia and brought with them not only weapons but a whole culture/religion.
Nice to be able to be contrarian: some other Forums ( Fora???) would have expelled me long ago :-)

Good note on the 'ricasso' Ariel!
Contrarian? not at all, a different viewpoint yes. Yours is a respected opinion, and different opinions keep it real. Its really been interesting looking into the different views, and I think thats what adds to the learning potential.

Thanks Ariel!
All the best,
Jim