pronunciation question: keris vs. kris

ganjawulung · 12th January 2009, 10:58 PM

IMHO, both words are correct from different views. Keris is Javanese and Indonesian pronounciation, and kris is English or other language than Indonesian pronounciation.

Indonesian tongue -- and mostly Javanese -- tends to add more vocal-syllabel to pronounce a certain word. Such as "spoor" (train) in Dutch language. The Javanese spells it as "sepur" for the same meaning. It is the same with "station" in English, or "station" (?) in Dutch. Javanese spells it as "setasiun".

But in "older" Javanese language, people used to find word -- written in one syllable, but actually must be spelled in two syllables, like "krta" (with special mark above the "r") which means "town". It must be spelled as "kerta". Or, "pakrti" as "pakarti"... Maybe too, for "kris" in old Javanese or Sanskrit which might be spelled as "keris".

GANJAWULUNG

sjors · 13th January 2009, 03:11 PM

Quote:

or "station" (?) in Dutch

Dear Ganjawulung, you're right, station is the proper Dutch word...
(and in real the Indonesian pronouncation sounds even more like the Dutch pronouncation then the English one

)

ganjawulung · 14th January 2009, 03:22 AM

Thank You, Sjors,

And this is just an intermezzo -- if you browse the internet with your search-engine, you will find several amazing sites of 'another keris'... Keris.net for instance, is the site of a freelance computer programmer whose name is actually Chris...

In Malaysia? Keris College is a name of an educational institution, the member of Keris Group Company since 1996, I think it is nothing to do with "your keris world".

In Korea? Keris is the abbreviation of Korea Educational and Research Information Service since 1999, of course it is nothing to do too with this Keris Warung Kopi.

In the United States? Keris Industries is a company -- installing new residential garage doors and openers... And also, if you are pet's lover then you will find "Keris-Lhasa-Apso", a puppy breeder company in Seattle, WA.

Even in the "keris country" like Indonesia, we have too a "keris" company that doesn't produce kerises at all. And that is "Batik Keris" -- a prominent batik (textile) company from Solo, Central Jawa...

GANJAWULUNG

Rick · 15th January 2009, 12:23 AM

Then there is the beer ...

TikiD · 15th January 2009, 04:20 AM

Thank you for this discussion. I think if I were to have a discussion with someone over this and want to argue for an authentic Javanese pronounciation, I might offer what Rick has said here:

"'k'rees' with just a trip of the tongue over the R."

Two syllables, emphasis on the second syllable.

But, of course, not many would use that pronounciation outside of Indonesia!

KuKulzA28 · 22nd January 2009, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

However, when the conversation is in Indonesian, I change my accent, and if I need to use an English word, I give it an Indonesian accented pronunciation. I have friends who are Italian, and Estonian, and Ukrainian, and they have told me they do a similar thing.

For a native English speaker the pronunciation of the word as "chris" is completely OK.

I'm Taiwanese Ameican, and I can speak English just fine, or Mandarin just fine... and I'm losing my fluency in Taiwanese.. but yes, pretty much the same thing... sometimes certain accents and sound just flow better with certain languages!

12th January 2009, 10:58 PM	#1
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	IMHO, both words are correct from different views. Keris is Javanese and Indonesian pronounciation, and kris is English or other language than Indonesian pronounciation. Indonesian tongue -- and mostly Javanese -- tends to add more vocal-syllabel to pronounce a certain word. Such as "spoor" (train) in Dutch language. The Javanese spells it as "sepur" for the same meaning. It is the same with "station" in English, or "station" (?) in Dutch. Javanese spells it as "setasiun". But in "older" Javanese language, people used to find word -- written in one syllable, but actually must be spelled in two syllables, like "krta" (with special mark above the "r") which means "town". It must be spelled as "kerta". Or, "pakrti" as "pakarti"... Maybe too, for "kris" in old Javanese or Sanskrit which might be spelled as "keris". GANJAWULUNG Last edited by ganjawulung; 13th January 2009 at 02:43 AM.

14th January 2009, 03:22 AM	#3
ganjawulung Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: J a k a r t a Posts: 991	Thank You, Sjors, And this is just an intermezzo -- if you browse the internet with your search-engine, you will find several amazing sites of 'another keris'... Keris.net for instance, is the site of a freelance computer programmer whose name is actually Chris... In Malaysia? Keris College is a name of an educational institution, the member of Keris Group Company since 1996, I think it is nothing to do with "your keris world". In Korea? Keris is the abbreviation of Korea Educational and Research Information Service since 1999, of course it is nothing to do too with this Keris Warung Kopi. In the United States? Keris Industries is a company -- installing new residential garage doors and openers... And also, if you are pet's lover then you will find "Keris-Lhasa-Apso", a puppy breeder company in Seattle, WA. Even in the "keris country" like Indonesia, we have too a "keris" company that doesn't produce kerises at all. And that is "Batik Keris" -- a prominent batik (textile) company from Solo, Central Jawa... GANJAWULUNG

15th January 2009, 12:23 AM	#4
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,339	Then there is the beer ...

15th January 2009, 04:20 AM	#5
TikiD Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 5	Thank you for this discussion. I think if I were to have a discussion with someone over this and want to argue for an authentic Javanese pronounciation, I might offer what Rick has said here: "'k'rees' with just a trip of the tongue over the R." Two syllables, emphasis on the second syllable. But, of course, not many would use that pronounciation outside of Indonesia!