Tenegre and mystery knife...

LabanTayo · 14th April 2005, 05:40 PM

Tom,
The horn hilt has shrunk and pushed the tang out.

The Bathead theory is just that, a theory.
Batheads are predominately from Batangas, but these swords that Spunjer and I have, are not from Batangas. They are Visayan. Panay or Negros.
One thing to look for in the Bathead are the fangs. They do not have them, for the most part. I have several examples of Tenegres / Binangons / Sanduko, with deities that look like Batheads, but they have the fangs.
The fangs are usually in the back of the mouth. I also have and example that is definetely from Panay, but does not have fangs. This is one of the road blocks in our research. Zel is in the Philippines now, and I'll be there next week. Hopefully we can get some answers. and beer. and food.

The inlay on my blade has been somewhat translated.
They are militia / religious symbols. I need more research on it before I state publicly what they mean. Hope you understand.

Federico · 14th April 2005, 09:08 PM

A while back Zel posted that the tenegres with metal guards were old (circa Katipunan era), the wood guards were even older, and the tear shape guards even older than those.

Spunjer · 14th April 2005, 10:54 PM

shelley,
thanks for your input! i have to say this is the first visayan sword i own that has some value. when i called the antique shop owner and said he had a sword that has a 'chameleon' head with three horns, i just about fell off my chair. at first i thought he meant one of those sandukos, but seeing what he had, i was happy with it, too.

about the batheads: most of you know that pilipinos are very superstitious. if this sword was indeed from panay, maybe this theory would make sense. one of the things that are still widely believed are supernatural beings called aswangs. now these aswangs, or blood suckers, are actually human being during daylight, but at night, they turn into these hideous creatures (http://pedia.nodeworks.com/A/AS/ASW/Aswang/). hideous as in they turn into this winged creatures with bat like wings. now there are towns in iloilo that are known to be these aswangs' lairs. one of them is duenas. also, the province of capiz is a pretty notorious place. my thinking is, and i'm sure the local population were aware of this reputation, these towns used the bathead as a design for their hilt. please don't shoot me; it's just a theory...

federico,
yeah, i think i read that someplace here...

tom,
it does kinda remind me of a talibon somewhat...

p.s.
labantayo, eat some sisig for me, will ya!!!

Conogre · 16th April 2005, 06:13 AM

Cool....even the Philippines has their own version of the vampire/ghoul myth, AKA "Ann Rice Does Manilla".
On the other hand, I've also heard that in parts of the islands the flying foxes are also eagerly sought after as food, in spite of the beliefs....then again, maybe it's on islands w/o the supernatural attribution that they appear on the menu (to the point that I've heard that they are now have protected/endangered status)
yes/no?

On that nore, good night all.
Mike

14th April 2005, 05:40 PM	#1
LabanTayo Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Kansas City Posts: 177	Tom, The horn hilt has shrunk and pushed the tang out. The Bathead theory is just that, a theory. Batheads are predominately from Batangas, but these swords that Spunjer and I have, are not from Batangas. They are Visayan. Panay or Negros. One thing to look for in the Bathead are the fangs. They do not have them, for the most part. I have several examples of Tenegres / Binangons / Sanduko, with deities that look like Batheads, but they have the fangs. The fangs are usually in the back of the mouth. I also have and example that is definetely from Panay, but does not have fangs. This is one of the road blocks in our research. Zel is in the Philippines now, and I'll be there next week. Hopefully we can get some answers. and beer. and food. The inlay on my blade has been somewhat translated. They are militia / religious symbols. I need more research on it before I state publicly what they mean. Hope you understand. Last edited by LabanTayo; 14th April 2005 at 08:55 PM.

14th April 2005, 09:08 PM	#2
Federico Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Minneapolis, MN, USA Posts: 312	A while back Zel posted that the tenegres with metal guards were old (circa Katipunan era), the wood guards were even older, and the tear shape guards even older than those.

14th April 2005, 10:54 PM	#3
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	shelley, thanks for your input! i have to say this is the first visayan sword i own that has some value. when i called the antique shop owner and said he had a sword that has a 'chameleon' head with three horns, i just about fell off my chair. at first i thought he meant one of those sandukos, but seeing what he had, i was happy with it, too. about the batheads: most of you know that pilipinos are very superstitious. if this sword was indeed from panay, maybe this theory would make sense. one of the things that are still widely believed are supernatural beings called aswangs. now these aswangs, or blood suckers, are actually human being during daylight, but at night, they turn into these hideous creatures (http://pedia.nodeworks.com/A/AS/ASW/Aswang/). hideous as in they turn into this winged creatures with bat like wings. now there are towns in iloilo that are known to be these aswangs' lairs. one of them is duenas. also, the province of capiz is a pretty notorious place. my thinking is, and i'm sure the local population were aware of this reputation, these towns used the bathead as a design for their hilt. please don't shoot me; it's just a theory... federico, yeah, i think i read that someplace here... tom, it does kinda remind me of a talibon somewhat... p.s. labantayo, eat some sisig for me, will ya!!!

16th April 2005, 06:13 AM	#4
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	Cool....even the Philippines has their own version of the vampire/ghoul myth, AKA "Ann Rice Does Manilla". On the other hand, I've also heard that in parts of the islands the flying foxes are also eagerly sought after as food, in spite of the beliefs....then again, maybe it's on islands w/o the supernatural attribution that they appear on the menu (to the point that I've heard that they are now have protected/endangered status) yes/no? On that nore, good night all. Mike