19th century fencing foils

broadaxe · 23rd November 2008, 05:04 PM

Jim, the citation is very interesting indeed.
Back the original subject, I'm aware of two individuals who are being regarded as a "living source" of classical and olympic fencing. Interestingly both were fencing instructors (one of them still is) and both hold private fencing museums:
Maitre (maestro) Rudy Van Oeveren http://musee.escrime.free.fr/
Maitre Jaque Castanet http://www.antiquaire-escrime.com.fr/index.htm
I have met with Mr. Castanet in person and visited his museum - it is most fascinating, and one can touch (and buy...) almost everything. Note the antique-looking swept-hilt foil on the opening page, it is possibly the oldest known survivng foil, circa 1670. For me, the section of sharp epees was the most interesting part, he has pairs of varied hilts including cup-hilt style that were used in Spanish colonies. If there is interest I can upload here some pics I took there.

Jim McDougall · 24th November 2008, 05:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by broadaxe

Jim, the citation is very interesting indeed.
Back the original subject, I'm aware of two individuals who are being regarded as a "living source" of classical and olympic fencing. Interestingly both were fencing instructors (one of them still is) and both hold private fencing museums:
Maitre (maestro) Rudy Van Oeveren http://musee.escrime.free.fr/
Maitre Jaque Castanet http://www.antiquaire-escrime.com.fr/index.htm
I have met with Mr. Castanet in person and visited his museum - it is most fascinating, and one can touch (and buy...) almost everything. Note the antique-looking swept-hilt foil on the opening page, it is possibly the oldest known survivng foil, circa 1670. For me, the section of sharp epees was the most interesting part, he has pairs of varied hilts including cup-hilt style that were used in Spanish colonies. If there is interest I can upload here some pics I took there.

Outstanding Broadaxe!!! There is indeed interest, so please post

Thank you for sharing these links!!

All the best,
Jim

kronckew · 24th November 2008, 10:50 AM

yes, broadaxe, please post more. i have a nostalgic fondness for the epee as i was trained in it and fenced on my varsity college team 40 odd years or so ago. (we had a very good hungarian coach, an ex- hungarian cavalry officer).

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s.../Yearbook2.jpg

broadaxe · 26th November 2008, 10:30 AM

Hungarians are very famous as fencers, espacialy with epee.
Here are some pics, feel free to post questions, I hope I can answer all

Chris Evans · 26th November 2008, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by broadaxe

Hungarians are very famous as fencers, espacialy with epee.
Here are some pics, feel free to post questions, I hope I can answer all

Hi,

Absolutely fantastic - Thank you for sharing them.

Some years ago, I sa a similar collection (in variety and scope) in Buenos Aires. Walked out with a very light wallet and a couple of swords.

Cheers
Chris

fernando · 26th November 2008, 07:59 PM

Beautyful pieces you show there, Broadaxe. Do they belong to you ? What a fascinating colection

.
If you people don't mind, let me take the opportunity to have in this thread some authorities in this area, and ask for coments on one "and half" foils i have; unfortunately one of them has a blade broken by its half length.
The entire one has a 87 cms blade and still keeps a very thin brass wire wraped around the leather grip. I never knew what the term BEDEL means.
All the marks on the blade are well visible. There is also the figure 5 engraved; i wonder if that represents the size of the sword.
The other example has a completely identical grip, only missing the wraping wire. The blade has only one mark, ASOLINGEN; i wonder what the letter "A" added to the word Solingen means.
Coments on these pieces would be much welcome, namely on their provenance and possible age.
Fernando

broadaxe · 26th November 2008, 10:13 PM

Hi Fernando. All the photos were taken at the private museum of Maitre Jaque Castanet in France. For me this is just a side field of interest. The number 5 stands for length of the blade, which is the adult standard. For youth it used to be #3, and there was a rare longer blade, #7. I don't remember the exact measures. The style of your hilt can be dated to the mid-19th century; please check if the fittings are nickel-plated steel thus indicate later age.

celtan · 27th November 2008, 10:55 AM

In Spain, a bedel is someone in charge of a building, and sometimes the term is used for minor administrative hotel employees.

In this case though, I believe its the name of the store that sold the epees. Aciers Bedel, or Steels Bedel.

The A before Solingen could likewise refer to Aceros or Acieres Solingen.

Best

M

Quote:

Originally Posted by
The entire one has a 87 cms blade and still keeps a very thin brass wire wraped around the leather grip. I never knew what the term BEDEL means.
All the marks on the blade are well visible. There is also the figure [b

5 [/b] engraved; i wonder if that represents the size of the sword.
The other example has a completely identical grip, only missing the wraping wire. The blade has only one mark, ASOLINGEN; i wonder what the letter "A" added to the word Solingen means.

26th November 2008, 10:30 AM	#4
broadaxe Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 334	Hungarians are very famous as fencers, espacialy with epee. Here are some pics, feel free to post questions, I hope I can answer all Attached Images

26th November 2008, 07:59 PM	#6
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Beautyful pieces you show there, Broadaxe. Do they belong to you ? What a fascinating colection . If you people don't mind, let me take the opportunity to have in this thread some authorities in this area, and ask for coments on one "and half" foils i have; unfortunately one of them has a blade broken by its half length. The entire one has a 87 cms blade and still keeps a very thin brass wire wraped around the leather grip. I never knew what the term BEDEL means. All the marks on the blade are well visible. There is also the figure 5 engraved; i wonder if that represents the size of the sword. The other example has a completely identical grip, only missing the wraping wire. The blade has only one mark, ASOLINGEN; i wonder what the letter "A" added to the word Solingen means. Coments on these pieces would be much welcome, namely on their provenance and possible age. Fernando Attached Images

23rd November 2008, 05:04 PM	#1
broadaxe Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 334	Jim, the citation is very interesting indeed. Back the original subject, I'm aware of two individuals who are being regarded as a "living source" of classical and olympic fencing. Interestingly both were fencing instructors (one of them still is) and both hold private fencing museums: Maitre (maestro) Rudy Van Oeveren http://musee.escrime.free.fr/ Maitre Jaque Castanet http://www.antiquaire-escrime.com.fr/index.htm I have met with Mr. Castanet in person and visited his museum - it is most fascinating, and one can touch (and buy...) almost everything. Note the antique-looking swept-hilt foil on the opening page, it is possibly the oldest known survivng foil, circa 1670. For me, the section of sharp epees was the most interesting part, he has pairs of varied hilts including cup-hilt style that were used in Spanish colonies. If there is interest I can upload here some pics I took there.

24th November 2008, 10:50 AM	#3
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,243	yes, broadaxe, please post more. i have a nostalgic fondness for the epee as i was trained in it and fenced on my varsity college team 40 odd years or so ago. (we had a very good hungarian coach, an ex- hungarian cavalry officer). http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s.../Yearbook2.jpg Last edited by kronckew; 24th November 2008 at 11:01 AM.

26th November 2008, 10:13 PM	#7
broadaxe Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 334	Hi Fernando. All the photos were taken at the private museum of Maitre Jaque Castanet in France. For me this is just a side field of interest. The number 5 stands for length of the blade, which is the adult standard. For youth it used to be #3, and there was a rare longer blade, #7. I don't remember the exact measures. The style of your hilt can be dated to the mid-19th century; please check if the fittings are nickel-plated steel thus indicate later age.