Voodoo doll

[David]

Originally Posted by Dajak

I don't think you right on this subject David .

It is world wide that they make an puppet somethimes with nail and or hair from the person and that they try to get control over you .

It can be find in many cultures .

You should read maybe the Wali Sanga .


The spijker fetisch you show had been used to get control over some people.



And I have seen real voodoo puppets from Haiti so they exist .

I don't now what you mean with Hollywood term but there is more in this world that we now or can see directly .

Ben

Sorry Ben, but i don't think that you have a very good grasp as to the purpose of some of these "puppets" as you call them. They are not meant to gain control over other, but are more for personal protection and spiritual growth. These spiked fetishes (minkisi) have much deeper uses than gaining power over another or causing harm. Read again the link i posted:

Minkisi empower the nganga (ritual specialist) to affect the lives of those who he consults with-- the chiefs who commune with ancestors to secure earthly power or the individuals who seek defense against the "witchcraft" practiced by others against them.
Minkisi are used to invoke supernatural power; a "personalized force from the invisible land of the dead (MacGaffey 1991:4)." Most commonly, this functionality includes
ending a dispute, making an agreement permanent, creating a mutual aid pact, healing oneself of an affliction, distancing or disempowering an enemy, protecting oneself against or finding out thieves, and assuring security when traveling away from home (Blier 1995:226).
The importance of minkisi is so great that the KiKongo term for the Christian concept holy is also nkisi (Thornton 1984:152). They are the most startling of Kongo religious objects, sometimes with iron spikes driven into them and open-mouthed figures staring menacingly at the viewer. Symbolic context is conveyed through materials as well as use. For example, kala zima (charcoal) is a medicine used to "strike all who are evilly disposed (MacGaffey 1991:5) and luhemba (chalk, clay) is added so
that the eyes of the nkisi are the nganga may be 'brightened,' which is why when they are preparing medicines, chalk is always the first (10).
These objects require the intervention of the nganga, to both conduct the rituals and maintain the objects. So important were nganga to religious practice that Christian priests identified themselves by the same term..

This is not the same as the general impression that people tend it have of the "Voodoo doll" that is used to control the lives of others and cause harm.If something that that does appear in other cultures then it should not be called a "Voodoo doll" since it has nothing to do with the Vodoun culture. The "real" Voodoo puppets you have seen is Haiti were probably some touristy thing because i repeat, these dolls are not a part of the Vodoun religion as it exists in Haiti. Figurative fetishes are used, but they are not what you are thinking of as "Voodoo dolls" used to control the lives of others. Just because you see some kind of doll doesn't mean someone is sticking pins in it to control other people. If you have some photos, please share.
For a deeper understanding of Vodou in Haiti i would highly recommend Maya Deren's Divine Horsemen and Secrets of Voodoo by Milo Rigaud.
And yes Ben, i am well aware of the invisible worlds and i am not denying the power of magick here.