French mameluke? first batch of images

Jean B. · 6th November 2008, 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by celtan

Hi Guys,

Obviously, Jean and Jim know much, much, so much more than I do about swords, that I can only accept their opinions as facts.

M

Hi Manolo,

I would like to give you one advise I am 100% sure it is a good one: for the sake of research, do NEVER, EVER accept an opinion as a fact if you feel you can discover something more. Research is indeed the fun part of collecting. Believe me, I would be more than happy if you come back to me in a few months saying: Hey Jean, I found evidences you were wrong, look at this...Sure, I would be happy to learn something new. I gave my personal opinion supported by observations but it is certainly not gospel.

All the best and....happy research!
Jean

Peu importe la destination si le voyage est plaisant.

celtan · 7th November 2008, 02:25 AM

"Peu importe la destination si le voyage est plaisant." Jean

Wouldn't that eminently apply to Life and Death?

Best

M

celtan · 8th November 2008, 11:03 PM

Another scythe...

Russian?

fernando · 8th November 2008, 11:08 PM

Amazing ... and fascinating.
The thing is so curved that the suspension rings are on the contrary side of the scabbard.
... no wonder

Fernando

celtan · 10th November 2008, 02:46 PM

BTW, what's the average length for the French M1822 saber blade?
This one has a 34 3/4" long blade, width 1.25" at the ricasso, and .75" near the rounded tip.

The blade was originally even longer, back before the tip was rounded.

M

fernando · 10th November 2008, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by celtan

BTW, what's the average length for the French M1822 saber blade?
This one has a 34 3/4" long blade, width 1.25" at the ricasso, and .75" near the rounded tip.
The blade was originally even longer, back before the tip was rounded.
M

Mine had 34 1/2" and weighed 0,774 kg. I didn't keep a record of the width. As far as i can remember, the cross section looked similar to this one. Not that i assimilate that a blade can be recurved in such manner without leaving deformation marks. I go more for the experiment prototype. But let me not say is a good specimen, as i hope to be its next owner when you get fed up of it; i fancy abnormal stuff ... like me

'Nando'

fernando · 10th November 2008, 03:08 PM

... But if you are measuring yours it in a straight line, then its miles longer than a 1822 ... correct ?

Jean B. · 12th November 2008, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by celtan

BTW, what's the average length for the French M1822 saber blade?
This one has a 34 3/4" long blade, width 1.25" at the ricasso, and .75" near the rounded tip.

The blade was originally even longer, back before the tip was rounded.

M

Originaly, the regulation length for a French Mle 1822 light cavalry sword is 92.5 cm which is about 36.4 inches.

After 1884, all remaining swords issued to troops were supposed to be shortened to 87.5 cm hence Fernando's measure.

Best,
Jean

celtan · 17th November 2008, 01:28 AM

Hi Jean,

Since mine is 88.26 cm _after_ having the tip rounded, it means that originally it was the longer 92.25 version, and the blade was never adjusted to the shorter post-1884 regs. It also suggests that the scythe shape was most probably done while the original longer blades prevailed, before 1884'.

Had it been a modified post-1884 blade, after rounding the tip, it would have been about 82 cm long. (minus ~4 cms.).

Thank you for your contributions, I just read your other comments on the AN XI sabre de cavalerie legere. They always make for interesting reading!

Best regards

Manuel

[QUOTE=Jean B.]Originaly, the regulation length for a French Mle 1822 light cavalry sword is 92.5 cm which is about 36.4 inches.

After 1884, all remaining swords issued to troops were supposed to be shortened to 87.5 cm hence Fernando's measure.

Best,
Jean

fernando · 10th November 2008, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by celtan

Another scythe...

Russian?

Bizarre

If it had the edge by the inside, it would be useful for cutting grass

.
Where did you get this picture ... is it confidential ?
Fernando

celtan · 17th November 2008, 01:05 AM

Hi Fernando,

No, it's not confidential at all, I plumb forgot.

Best

M

Quote:

Originally Posted by fernando

Bizarre

If it had the edge by the inside, it would be useful for cutting grass

.
Where did you get this picture ... is it confidential ?
Fernando

Jim McDougall · 21st November 2008, 02:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by celtan

Another scythe...

Russian?

Unbelievable!!! I have seen parabolic blades before.....but NEVER one this dramatic!
Most definitely Russian, I believe these as well as many of thier regulation patterns were based on captured French Napoleonic weapons (I dont have my copy of Mollo handy, "Russian Military Swords" Eugene Mollo).
I believe this hilt was based on the French model ANXI.....but have no idea what was behind this blade.
The carrying rings are on the opposed side as was characteristic of thier military swords, as well as shashkas.

All best regards,
Jim

8th November 2008, 11:03 PM	#3
celtan Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: PR, USA Posts: 679	Another scythe... Russian? Attached Images

17th November 2008, 01:28 AM	#9
celtan Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: PR, USA Posts: 679	Hi Jean, Since mine is 88.26 cm _after_ having the tip rounded, it means that originally it was the longer 92.25 version, and the blade was never adjusted to the shorter post-1884 regs. It also suggests that the scythe shape was most probably done while the original longer blades prevailed, before 1884'. Had it been a modified post-1884 blade, after rounding the tip, it would have been about 82 cm long. (minus ~4 cms.). Thank you for your contributions, I just read your other comments on the AN XI sabre de cavalerie legere. They always make for interesting reading! Best regards Manuel [QUOTE=Jean B.]Originaly, the regulation length for a French Mle 1822 light cavalry sword is 92.5 cm which is about 36.4 inches. After 1884, all remaining swords issued to troops were supposed to be shortened to 87.5 cm hence Fernando's measure. Best, Jean Last edited by celtan; 17th November 2008 at 05:28 PM.

7th November 2008, 02:25 AM	#2
celtan Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: PR, USA Posts: 679	"Peu importe la destination si le voyage est plaisant." Jean Wouldn't that eminently apply to Life and Death? Best M

8th November 2008, 11:08 PM	#4
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Amazing ... and fascinating. The thing is so curved that the suspension rings are on the contrary side of the scabbard. ... no wonder Fernando

10th November 2008, 02:46 PM	#5
celtan Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: PR, USA Posts: 679	BTW, what's the average length for the French M1822 saber blade? This one has a 34 3/4" long blade, width 1.25" at the ricasso, and .75" near the rounded tip. The blade was originally even longer, back before the tip was rounded. M

10th November 2008, 03:08 PM	#7
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	... But if you are measuring yours it in a straight line, then its miles longer than a 1822 ... correct ?