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24th September 2008, 11:03 PM
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#1 |
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Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: The Sharp end
Posts: 2,928
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Hmm, Well I did buy it as a circa 1580 sword, and I always believed it was early rather than late. Is it too much to hope that it was actually made by the Sahagun father?
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25th September 2008, 12:15 AM
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#2 | |
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(deceased)
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal
Posts: 9,694
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Quote:
 Fernando |
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26th September 2008, 04:33 PM
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#3 | |
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Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: The Sharp end
Posts: 2,928
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Quote:
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26th September 2008, 07:52 PM
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#4 | |
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Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: PR, USA
Posts: 679
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Wasn't Sahagun the name of The Shadows Weapon Factory Planet in "Babylon 5"?
: ) Me' self, I have never seen an original Sahagun blade. The one we have here is badly spelled: Samacum. Cheers M Quote:
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26th September 2008, 08:21 PM
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#5 | |
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Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: The Sharp end
Posts: 2,928
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Quote:
LOL, that was Z'ha'dum! I've been watching seasons 3 and 4 over the last few days while working! Great series. Where is the misspelt one? Can you post a pic or a link? I assume mine is spelt correctly? Well assuming they were always spelt in latin? the inscription on my blade is 'S A H A G V N' do we know if they used 'U' or 'V'? Regards Gene |
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28th September 2008, 05:55 PM
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#6 |
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Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: The Sharp end
Posts: 2,928
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More a bump than anything else!
Just wanting to recap and try and decide if we've actually decided anything concrete about my sword? So, it may not stricly be regarded as simply a Bilbo, not that bilbo is anything more than a victorian collectors term anyway, but you know what I mean. So what would we call it? 'Spanish Rapier'? The Blade Inscription purports to be the makers name and not the place of origin. Some of its elements seem to indicate an early date, some a later date. And thats it?  Gene |
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28th September 2008, 06:50 PM
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#7 | |
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Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: PR, USA
Posts: 679
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I would call it a "Period rapier made in the spanish style".
They often used V instead of U, but it should be pronounced U, and the latter is the correct spelling also. Also, Bilbo is a connotation for a cheaply made sword made for export... Best Manuel Luis Quote:
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28th September 2008, 06:59 PM
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#8 |
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(deceased)
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal
Posts: 9,694
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Some (most) times is easier to be told what specimens are not, than what they are. So many weapons are a mix of styles ... whether added within time or originaly intended by the maker. A significant quantity of my stuff falls into that area
.It appears than in (Iberian) typology, you have the 'sword' as so called, belonging to 'military' universe and the 'rapier', that of 'civilian' development ... although also used by military, in determined contexts. Two (of the?) sympthoms which indicate that the piece is a rapier are, the blade being narrow (er), more vocationed to fencing and the knuckle bow being loose, and not screwed or welded to the pommel, a detail not neglectable in Ordnance combat examples. So your specimen could be called a rapier, although with some military features like, i guess, its guard, typically called boca de caballo (horse mouth), as already mentioned here by the connoisseurs. A couple forumites can tell you that this guard did not exist till the beg. XVIII century; therefore a pattern later than the (beg. XVII century?) grip. Then if you fix the grip date as being originaly assembled to the (imported blade), you will find that the Sahagun legend is not the maker's mark but an allegory to him, to add value to the blade. This way you could say that, basically, this is a XVII century rapier, with a later military type guard addition. I don't beleive i dared to adventure giving a presumptious opinnion in such matters.. ... Just forget it  Fernando |
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