Moro / Borneo hybrid ?

Rick · 11th August 2008, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royston

A wild guess would be that it belonged to an Iban Dayak who went on raids together with Moros and then later converted to Islam (which made him change the hilt and add the motifs to his blade)

Michael, Amazing powers of deduction.
Er, can you tell me what his name was ?

thanks again

Royston

Umm, before or after he converted ??

Seriously though; heating the blade may render it removable from the hilt .

P.Abrera · 11th August 2008, 05:01 PM

What leads/clues are we looking for if the handle can be removed?

VANDOO · 11th August 2008, 06:24 PM

SEVERAL YEARS AGO I BOUGHT A COLLECTION OF VARIOUS PHILIPPINE SWORDS. THERE WAS ONE SWORD REFERED TO AS A GAYONG THAT HAD A MANDAU STYLE HANDLE. YOUR SWORD REMINDS ME OF THE EXAMPLES IN THAT COLLECTION WHICH WAS COLLECTED IN 1944 THRU 1946 IN MINDANAO.
SEARCH IN THE OLD FORUMS UNDER TOPICS , "VANDOO'S MORO PIECES" (GAYONG) IS THE DAYAK LIKE SWORD, POSTED 6-20-2002 BY RICK, UNFORTUNATELY THE PICTURES ON SOME OF THE OTHER ITEMS IN THE COLLECTION ARE GONE BUT THE INFORMATION IS STILL THERE AND THE PICTURES OF THE GAYONG ARE STILL THERE. YOUR SWORD MAY HAVE SIMULAR ORGINS TO THE ONES IN THIS COLLECTION. A VERY NICE SWORD.

AS TO REMOVING THE HANDLE THE ONLY THING THAT COULD BE LEARNED FROM THAT IS IF THE BLADE IS OLDER OR NEWER THAN THE HANDLE. THE BLADE LOOKS VERY CLEAN AND IF THE TANG IS AS CLEAN I WOULD SUSPECT THE BLADE AND FITTINGS WERE MADE AT THE SAME TIME. THE ITEMS IN MY COLLECTION MENTIONED ABOVE DO NOT SHOW MUCH WEAR AND MOST OF THEM NEVER SAW ANY USE AND THE BLADES WERE MADE AT THE SAME TIME AS THE FITTINGS. THE MANDAU HANDLE DOSEN'T SHOW MUCH USE BUT WAS NOT MADE AT THE SAME TIME AS THE BLADE AS FAR AS I CAN TELL. MOST OF THE ITEMS IN THE COLLECTION DUE TO THE PROVENANCE COULD NOT HAVE BEEN MADE ANY LATER THAN 1946 AND WERE PROBABLY MADE A BIT BEFORE THAT, BUT ARE LIKE NEW AS THEY WERE STORED VERY WELL.

kino · 12th August 2008, 01:58 AM

Yakan..yes, but not necessarily a Barung, maybe orginally it could have been mounted on a................................

VVV · 12th August 2008, 09:24 AM

Thanks for posting the Pira Kino. It's good to be reminded about that not everything always has to be "by the book".

I had a look at the old post of Gayong and strange Moro weapons etc.
Is there any possibility to republish those pictures again on the forum, PLEASE?
A Gayang in Sabah is like a mandau/ilang but with a flat blade.
They were also produced on Borneo but not with the kind of blade shape like the one posted in the old thread.

On removing the handle there could of course be a commercial reason as well...

Michael

Battara · 13th August 2008, 02:20 AM

Thanks Kino, I plain forgot......

Dajak · 13th August 2008, 06:43 AM

Langai tingal is an Iban sword so blade is Iban

But to see if it is old need to be the Handle off

If the Handle is off I can see if it is old style or newly made
that s why I ask can the handle off .

Ben

11th August 2008, 06:24 PM	#3
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	SEVERAL YEARS AGO I BOUGHT A COLLECTION OF VARIOUS PHILIPPINE SWORDS. THERE WAS ONE SWORD REFERED TO AS A GAYONG THAT HAD A MANDAU STYLE HANDLE. YOUR SWORD REMINDS ME OF THE EXAMPLES IN THAT COLLECTION WHICH WAS COLLECTED IN 1944 THRU 1946 IN MINDANAO. SEARCH IN THE OLD FORUMS UNDER TOPICS , "VANDOO'S MORO PIECES" (GAYONG) IS THE DAYAK LIKE SWORD, POSTED 6-20-2002 BY RICK, UNFORTUNATELY THE PICTURES ON SOME OF THE OTHER ITEMS IN THE COLLECTION ARE GONE BUT THE INFORMATION IS STILL THERE AND THE PICTURES OF THE GAYONG ARE STILL THERE. YOUR SWORD MAY HAVE SIMULAR ORGINS TO THE ONES IN THIS COLLECTION. A VERY NICE SWORD. AS TO REMOVING THE HANDLE THE ONLY THING THAT COULD BE LEARNED FROM THAT IS IF THE BLADE IS OLDER OR NEWER THAN THE HANDLE. THE BLADE LOOKS VERY CLEAN AND IF THE TANG IS AS CLEAN I WOULD SUSPECT THE BLADE AND FITTINGS WERE MADE AT THE SAME TIME. THE ITEMS IN MY COLLECTION MENTIONED ABOVE DO NOT SHOW MUCH WEAR AND MOST OF THEM NEVER SAW ANY USE AND THE BLADES WERE MADE AT THE SAME TIME AS THE FITTINGS. THE MANDAU HANDLE DOSEN'T SHOW MUCH USE BUT WAS NOT MADE AT THE SAME TIME AS THE BLADE AS FAR AS I CAN TELL. MOST OF THE ITEMS IN THE COLLECTION DUE TO THE PROVENANCE COULD NOT HAVE BEEN MADE ANY LATER THAN 1946 AND WERE PROBABLY MADE A BIT BEFORE THAT, BUT ARE LIKE NEW AS THEY WERE STORED VERY WELL. Last edited by VANDOO; 11th August 2008 at 06:44 PM.

12th August 2008, 01:58 AM	#4
kino Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,018	Yakan..yes, but not necessarily a Barung, maybe orginally it could have been mounted on a................................ Attached Images

11th August 2008, 05:01 PM	#2
P.Abrera Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 20	What leads/clues are we looking for if the handle can be removed?

12th August 2008, 09:24 AM	#5
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Thanks for posting the Pira Kino. It's good to be reminded about that not everything always has to be "by the book". I had a look at the old post of Gayong and strange Moro weapons etc. Is there any possibility to republish those pictures again on the forum, PLEASE? A Gayang in Sabah is like a mandau/ilang but with a flat blade. They were also produced on Borneo but not with the kind of blade shape like the one posted in the old thread. On removing the handle there could of course be a commercial reason as well... Michael

13th August 2008, 02:20 AM	#6
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,272	Thanks Kino, I plain forgot......

13th August 2008, 06:43 AM	#7
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	Langai tingal is an Iban sword so blade is Iban But to see if it is old need to be the Handle off If the Handle is off I can see if it is old style or newly made that s why I ask can the handle off . Ben