It certainly is very old ... but what is it ?

[Royston]

Fernando,

I am away from home at work for the next couple of weeks, when I get back I will have a sort through the " Spear Pile " I am almost certain I still have a spear with this type of marking on it. If I can find it I will post.

Royston

[katana]

Hi Fernando ,
I also believe it is a spear butt. A spiked butt had a use for 'sticking' in the ground..... and 'if needs must' your enemy.

It is unlikely this was a counterweight for a throwing spear. Throwing spears by definition are lighter (in weight) to achieve greater distance.... usually iron is 'coiled' wrapped at the butt end if weight was required.

The type of spear with a spiked butt are usually the 'held' type and often used in battle like a wooden staff (quarter staff, 'Bo' the Japanese version etc) Obviously the bladed spearhead could be used to stab, but also was used to slash / cut when used in an arcing motion. The spiked butt was useful for defence from attacks from the rear or side.

The Masai, when facing a lion, have been reported as holding the spear, butt stuck into the ground as the lion leaps to attack. In this way the animal's weight provides the penetrative force...the butt prevents the spear from 'sliding'.

Shaka, modified the traditional spear by shortening the shaft and increasing the size of the bladed spearhead. Due to the 'regimented' tactics he employed ie lines of zulu's using shields to deflect attack and expose the assailant to a stabbing attack. (A very similar tactic used by the Romans .. ...however they used the gladius, the short stabbing sword which was well suited to this technique.)
Shaka negated the spear butt because (a) having 'lines' of men in rows meant that their 'backs' were protected and (b) with the 'row' in front stabbing the enemy there was a real danger of a spear butt injurying warriors in the 'row' behind ....ouch

Your example could be ceremonial, but am sure a spear butt nethertheless.

Kind Regards David

[fernando]

Originally Posted by katana

Hi Fernando ... I also believe it is a spear butt ...
... Your example could be ceremonial, but am sure a spear butt nethertheless.

I David,
I have missed your post, which you submitted whilst i was "rehearsing" mine. You know, some times i have to go back a zillion times to "improve" my louzy english in the paragraphs i find more bizarre, so my posts take ages to be submited.
Say, would you tell this piece is European or African ... which is almost the same as telling, would this be a modern or an ancient object ?
Fernando

[katana]

Originally Posted by fernando

I David,
You know, some times i have to go back a zillion times to "improve" my louzy english .............................................

Say, would you tell this piece is European or African ... which is almost the same as telling, would this be a modern or an ancient object ?
Fernando

Hi Fernando,
firstly..... your English is excellent ....but please dont ask me to reply in Portugese

I am not certain as to the origins...or date. Instinct suggests African but....there is a nagging doubt which I cannot 'put my finger on'.

Looking at the pictures I noticed, what appears to be a rusted rivet or 'nail' ....it follows the 'centre line' position of the 'open' fixing hole. If this is the case, I personally have not seen a 'double fixing' on an African spearhead or butt

Regards David

PS The other hole looks to be 'punched' rather than drilled. if this is the case it would have probably been done during forging, further suggesting either 'primatively' made (meaning without more technical (industrial) tools such as a drill bit) or 'good' age ....

[fernando]

Well David,
My english was learnt in the streets; it's only mediocre because i keep checking it in the dictionary ... or in the web .
It's amazing how different eyes can see distinct things
I don't think that's a nail mark at all; there's no countermark on the other side. What i see there is some kind of punch, like a maker's mark or symbol of some kind. That´s precisely the first sympthom that made me think this thing is European .
... Plus the the iron structure, namely the socket; wouldn't African stuff be thinner ?
Fernando

[katana]

Originally Posted by fernando

... Plus the the iron structure, namely the socket; wouldn't African stuff be thinner ?
Fernando

Hi Fernando,
I have an old African spear which has 'heavy' socketted butt and spearhead.....so the 'thickness' doesn't mean it can't be African. You have to bear in mind that the butt aids the balance of the spear, even if it is not a 'throwing' type ( 'hand held' spears tend to have heavy 'heads' ) A balanced spear makes it much easier to use in combat (for the same reasons as a nicely 'balanced' sword would)

Could you post a 'close-up' picture of the 'rivet marking' ?

Regards David

[Lew]

The markings on the this spear thing seems North African to me? The Xs with the line through them often symbolize a stylized crocodile which are used by the tribes who live along the Nile in the Sudan and Egypt.

Lew

[fernando]

Originally Posted by Royston

... I am almost certain I still have a spear with this type of marking on it. If I can find it I will post.
Royston

Thank you so much, Royston.


Fernando