Machete from Span-Am war?

Jim McDougall · 28th April 2008, 09:59 PM

Hi Carlos,
Thank you for posting this. These seem to be largely Spanish American War bringbacks, and about fifteen years ago, maybe longer, I found one exactly like this that was said provenanced from Monterrey, Mexico. Lots of research later, I was told by an authority on Spanish colonial weapons that these were from Cuba brought back by military during the Spanish American War.

According to authorities in Spain, these are typically considered from the Philippines, but given the Spanish trade routes this certainly seems possible as well. The blade on mine had the deep stamps in rows the full length of the blade, which was heavily patinated so seemed much earlier than the Spanish American War period.

The shellguard is interesting also with the multiple striated lines which correspond to shellguard espana anchas attributed now to Brazil c.1800 (see the pirate weapons thread, posted by Mark Eley).

I have no idea what those rows of deep marks might mean, but in the repitition seen appear to be simply motif.

Has anyone seen these show up in Philippine regions?

All best regards,
Jim

Battara · 29th April 2008, 01:07 AM

Yes I have (and have seen) Spanish-American sword bring backs.......

BUT NOTHING LIKE THIS PIECE!

Rick · 29th April 2008, 02:10 AM

Yes, didn't we see this hilt form also referenced in a Berber Sabre thread ?
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...t=berber+sabre

Jim McDougall · 29th April 2008, 02:40 AM

Rick, how do you do it!!! Your memory and eye is amazing!!

That sure is it OK.
The blade on the one I had was pretty rough, and it had the guard but no striations. This one is really nice.

All the best,
Jim

OAKSP · 29th April 2008, 10:52 PM

WOW !!!!

Seems to be a customized ancient colonial sword for Spanish American Campaing....

More info at
http://www.catalogacionarmas.com/public/34-Ultramar.pdf

A good piece !!!!!!!!!

ariel · 30th April 2008, 01:37 AM

I cannot help but re-post my earlier ( somewhat embarrassing ) contribution:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=4874
I showed another sword with identical markings and a Nimcha marked " Nueva Granada" ( now Colombia).
I guess Spanish South American blades did end up in North Africa.

Jim McDougall · 30th April 2008, 03:06 AM

Actually that was an excellent contribution Ariel! so cant see why you would be embarrassed.........now when I reread my posts analyzing these ....Cuba, Algeria, Philippines, Balkans, Bedouins etc etc....good grief! I brought in everything but Elvis and UFO's!!! now thats embarrassing

Excellent example that Marc posted there, and I thought your sabre was really an attractive item.

OAKSP, excellent item you show here also. It really is amazing how many weapons we have looked at over the years and considered Spanish colonial or North African, and never realized the possibility of Cuba and South America.

All the best,
Jim

29th April 2008, 10:52 PM	#5
OAKSP Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: SPAIN Posts: 21	SPANISH AMERICAN WOW !!!! Seems to be a customized ancient colonial sword for Spanish American Campaing.... More info at http://www.catalogacionarmas.com/public/34-Ultramar.pdf A good piece !!!!!!!!!

28th April 2008, 09:59 PM	#1
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,581	Hi Carlos, Thank you for posting this. These seem to be largely Spanish American War bringbacks, and about fifteen years ago, maybe longer, I found one exactly like this that was said provenanced from Monterrey, Mexico. Lots of research later, I was told by an authority on Spanish colonial weapons that these were from Cuba brought back by military during the Spanish American War. According to authorities in Spain, these are typically considered from the Philippines, but given the Spanish trade routes this certainly seems possible as well. The blade on mine had the deep stamps in rows the full length of the blade, which was heavily patinated so seemed much earlier than the Spanish American War period. The shellguard is interesting also with the multiple striated lines which correspond to shellguard espana anchas attributed now to Brazil c.1800 (see the pirate weapons thread, posted by Mark Eley). I have no idea what those rows of deep marks might mean, but in the repitition seen appear to be simply motif. Has anyone seen these show up in Philippine regions? All best regards, Jim

29th April 2008, 01:07 AM	#2
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,323	Yes I have (and have seen) Spanish-American sword bring backs....... BUT NOTHING LIKE THIS PIECE!

29th April 2008, 02:10 AM	#3
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,365	Yes, didn't we see this hilt form also referenced in a Berber Sabre thread ? http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...t=berber+sabre

29th April 2008, 02:40 AM	#4
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,581	Rick, how do you do it!!! Your memory and eye is amazing!! That sure is it OK. The blade on the one I had was pretty rough, and it had the guard but no striations. This one is really nice. All the best, Jim

30th April 2008, 01:37 AM	#6
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	I cannot help but re-post my earlier ( somewhat embarrassing ) contribution: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=4874 I showed another sword with identical markings and a Nimcha marked " Nueva Granada" ( now Colombia). I guess Spanish South American blades did end up in North Africa.

30th April 2008, 03:06 AM	#7
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,581	Actually that was an excellent contribution Ariel! so cant see why you would be embarrassed.........now when I reread my posts analyzing these ....Cuba, Algeria, Philippines, Balkans, Bedouins etc etc....good grief! I brought in everything but Elvis and UFO's!!! now thats embarrassing Excellent example that Marc posted there, and I thought your sabre was really an attractive item. OAKSP, excellent item you show here also. It really is amazing how many weapons we have looked at over the years and considered Spanish colonial or North African, and never realized the possibility of Cuba and South America. All the best, Jim