Dutch - VOC Blade - HELP! needed

Amuk Murugul · 27th April 2008, 06:44 AM

Hullo everybody

,

Jim,
Thank you for your reply.
I am doing this for a friend who doesn't speak English very well.
We share an interest in implements used/adopted/adapted by the Sunda.

Some time ago, he was offered a sword. Apparently, it looked a bit like a Klewang. The handle was rather crude, with a D guard and a brass sheet wrapped over the grip. The blade had 1606 VOC marked on both sides.
He declined the offer, but it has been niggling him ever since ("Was it fake?").

My research has found nothing.

However, I remember, some time back, coming across an article (on the Internet and in Dutch) about the tell-tales of Dutch blades and how to spot a fake. As it was not part of my research at the time, I didn't want to be distracted and moved on.
Now I can no longer find the article. (I should've tagged it when I had the chance).

I hope I have answered your question about my interest.

Thank you again.

Henk · 27th April 2008, 10:31 AM

I doubt weapons were marked with the VOC mark in that early period of the VOC.
Most weapons in that period were made in Solingen and assembled in Köln. Also in Luik (Liege) Belgium many weapons were produced.
The VOC had a large private army, but the Dutch soldiers in that time had to buy their own equipment. 75% of the soldiers of the VOC were foreigners. Most of them came from Poland, Sweden, Danmark and Germany.
I don't say that it is impossible that a blade was marked with the VOC mark but it is most unlikely.

Blades with a VOC mark came up in the 18th century. In that period the army of the VOC became more standardized with rules for the equipment.

Amak Murugul,

VOC blades are hard to find and very expensive. Without a picture of the sword it is hard to tell if the sword offered to your friend is a fake but I think he did well by declining the offer.

M ELEY · 27th April 2008, 11:06 AM

I seem to recall a VOC-marked sword with the talismanic marking 1606 on it even though it was an 18th century sword. Likewise, I know of a smallsword marked with the VOC marking that dates to 1660, a later period than we're discussing, but still 17th century...

Jim McDougall · 28th April 2008, 09:45 PM

It would be interesting to find some sort of chronological history of the VOC marking as seen on the 18th century blades, maybe a coin catalog might reflect coins that carry the mark. It seems the coins I have seen with the mark are about 1760's much as the blades I have seen. I think Henk is right noting the organization that became more prevalent contributing to the probable reason for more visability of the marks then.

Mark, the smallsword you note sounds most intriguing, but I wonder if the 1606 on the other sword was talismanic, maybe the 1660 was also...like the numbers 1414 and 1441. I forget what they call the rearranged numbers, and can only think of anagram with letters, but you know what I mean.
It seems that on some Dutch swords significant dates might be added noting important events?

I've always thought the Dutch East India VOC markings were really appealing much as those of the British East India Co. but never was lucky enough to find swords with such marks on the blades.

All best regards,
Jim

27th April 2008, 06:44 AM	#1
Amuk Murugul Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Kaboejoetan Galoenggoeng Mélben Posts: 472	Hullo everybody , Jim, Thank you for your reply. I am doing this for a friend who doesn't speak English very well. We share an interest in implements used/adopted/adapted by the Sunda. Some time ago, he was offered a sword. Apparently, it looked a bit like a Klewang. The handle was rather crude, with a D guard and a brass sheet wrapped over the grip. The blade had 1606 VOC marked on both sides. He declined the offer, but it has been niggling him ever since ("Was it fake?"). My research has found nothing. However, I remember, some time back, coming across an article (on the Internet and in Dutch) about the tell-tales of Dutch blades and how to spot a fake. As it was not part of my research at the time, I didn't want to be distracted and moved on. Now I can no longer find the article. (I should've tagged it when I had the chance). I hope I have answered your question about my interest. Thank you again.

27th April 2008, 10:31 AM	#2
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	I doubt weapons were marked with the VOC mark in that early period of the VOC. Most weapons in that period were made in Solingen and assembled in Köln. Also in Luik (Liege) Belgium many weapons were produced. The VOC had a large private army, but the Dutch soldiers in that time had to buy their own equipment. 75% of the soldiers of the VOC were foreigners. Most of them came from Poland, Sweden, Danmark and Germany. I don't say that it is impossible that a blade was marked with the VOC mark but it is most unlikely. Blades with a VOC mark came up in the 18th century. In that period the army of the VOC became more standardized with rules for the equipment. Amak Murugul, VOC blades are hard to find and very expensive. Without a picture of the sword it is hard to tell if the sword offered to your friend is a fake but I think he did well by declining the offer.

27th April 2008, 11:06 AM	#3
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,141	I seem to recall a VOC-marked sword with the talismanic marking 1606 on it even though it was an 18th century sword. Likewise, I know of a smallsword marked with the VOC marking that dates to 1660, a later period than we're discussing, but still 17th century...

28th April 2008, 09:45 PM	#4
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,196	It would be interesting to find some sort of chronological history of the VOC marking as seen on the 18th century blades, maybe a coin catalog might reflect coins that carry the mark. It seems the coins I have seen with the mark are about 1760's much as the blades I have seen. I think Henk is right noting the organization that became more prevalent contributing to the probable reason for more visability of the marks then. Mark, the smallsword you note sounds most intriguing, but I wonder if the 1606 on the other sword was talismanic, maybe the 1660 was also...like the numbers 1414 and 1441. I forget what they call the rearranged numbers, and can only think of anagram with letters, but you know what I mean. It seems that on some Dutch swords significant dates might be added noting important events? I've always thought the Dutch East India VOC markings were really appealing much as those of the British East India Co. but never was lucky enough to find swords with such marks on the blades. All best regards, Jim