Asian dagger for comment

josh stout · 6th March 2008, 04:25 PM

I have been thinking about this knife a bit. The Tibetan, Bhutanese, Chinese, combination of influences is clear. The blade is more slim than most Tibetan examples with the look of Bhutanese style which also goes with the lozenge pommel. As pointed out though, the way it was put together does not indicate Bhutan, while it does strongly suggest a piece from the border of Tibet and China. The horn handle with decorated rivets resembles pieces from outlying villages in China with perhaps a minority influence. Also as pointed out, the ring attachment resembles Mongolian/Chinese knives. I have seen a Mongolian dagger with similar pattern welding that was also slim bladed in this fashion.

My best guess is that this comes from the Tibetan plateau region of Qinghai province north of Sichuan. This is partially based on triangulating the combination of influences. However, it is based even more on what I see on the market these days. Qinghai province is only recently opening up, and it has kept its Tibetan culture with very little outside influence until recently. In the last couple of years, many unusual Tibetan pieces have been showing up on the market in styles rarely or never seen previously. Riveted horn handles are quite common on these pieces while I think they are rare on more traditional Tibetan things. I have three horn handled Tibetan sabers in my collection with very good attribution that I am absolutely sure came from Qinghai. Actually, every example that I can think of where a Tibetan saber has a horn handle turns out to be from Qinghai. I am sure there are counter examples out there, but I have not seen them. Obviously with knives, horn handles are more common from all regions, but still I think there is enough evidence to make a good guess.

If this piece has been in a collection for many years then all bets are off, but if this new to the market as I suspect, then I think it is from Qinghai.
Josh

kronckew · 6th March 2008, 05:00 PM

hi josh, thanks for the added info. the more knowledge the better

it came from a general antique dealer without any provenance as to where it had been living before he got it. the only info is that he thought it was chinese possibly 18th century. i'll try emailing him to see if he has any info on where he got it that he can release....

kronckew · 7th March 2008, 04:06 PM

the dealer i got it from has told me he bought it in a bric-a-brac market stall, he's going back there next week & will ask them if they have any more info on where they got it. watch this space, but don't hold yer breath.

6th March 2008, 04:25 PM	#1
josh stout Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 407	I have been thinking about this knife a bit. The Tibetan, Bhutanese, Chinese, combination of influences is clear. The blade is more slim than most Tibetan examples with the look of Bhutanese style which also goes with the lozenge pommel. As pointed out though, the way it was put together does not indicate Bhutan, while it does strongly suggest a piece from the border of Tibet and China. The horn handle with decorated rivets resembles pieces from outlying villages in China with perhaps a minority influence. Also as pointed out, the ring attachment resembles Mongolian/Chinese knives. I have seen a Mongolian dagger with similar pattern welding that was also slim bladed in this fashion. My best guess is that this comes from the Tibetan plateau region of Qinghai province north of Sichuan. This is partially based on triangulating the combination of influences. However, it is based even more on what I see on the market these days. Qinghai province is only recently opening up, and it has kept its Tibetan culture with very little outside influence until recently. In the last couple of years, many unusual Tibetan pieces have been showing up on the market in styles rarely or never seen previously. Riveted horn handles are quite common on these pieces while I think they are rare on more traditional Tibetan things. I have three horn handled Tibetan sabers in my collection with very good attribution that I am absolutely sure came from Qinghai. Actually, every example that I can think of where a Tibetan saber has a horn handle turns out to be from Qinghai. I am sure there are counter examples out there, but I have not seen them. Obviously with knives, horn handles are more common from all regions, but still I think there is enough evidence to make a good guess. If this piece has been in a collection for many years then all bets are off, but if this new to the market as I suspect, then I think it is from Qinghai. Josh

6th March 2008, 05:00 PM	#2
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,215	hi josh, thanks for the added info. the more knowledge the better it came from a general antique dealer without any provenance as to where it had been living before he got it. the only info is that he thought it was chinese possibly 18th century. i'll try emailing him to see if he has any info on where he got it that he can release....

7th March 2008, 04:06 PM	#3
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,215	the dealer i got it from has told me he bought it in a bric-a-brac market stall, he's going back there next week & will ask them if they have any more info on where they got it. watch this space, but don't hold yer breath.