Could this be my first Tegha?

Jim McDougall · 24th January 2008, 06:26 PM

Hi Bally,
I can well understand being anxious and excited when awaiting the arrival of a newly acquired weapon, as I'm sure most of us do, so no worries about impatience OK? The best thing is that you have shared it here with us, and as I mentioned, many of us head for notes and references...just so you know in many ways we are all learning together.

You're doing pretty well for a beginner! This is a very nice example, and the noticeable upward curve and widened tip on a heavier than usual blade is what in my perception would allow the 'tegha' term to what would otherwise be considered a standard hilt talwar.

You are doing well in noting the spike form pommel rather than the cap or button, which would in my opinion further suggest Rajput attribution. In many cases the curved appendage as seen on the Hindu basket hilt (typically termed 'khanda' or if it has foreign blade 'firangi') has been seen on some tulwars in varied degree, more or less vestigially recalling that feature on these characteristically Rajput swords. We know that they were used by others as well, but that is another discussion.

As Ariel has noted, it is very difficult to attribute certain hilts to specific regions with talwars, as well as indeed trying to determine period .Standard forms were used over centuries so relying on subtle element variation and basic 'forensics' is often the only way to suggest possible dating.

G.N.Pant in his "Indian Arms and Armour" made a substantial effort in trying to establish a systemic designation of talwar hilts, and while it serves well as a benchmark with varying degree of validity, it would be unlikely to consider it more than a guideline.

Your hilt is as you have already surmised, probably Rajput, and quite likely from Rajasthan in the 19th c. These swords were often remounted, and I look forward to seeing better photos when this one arrives.

As discussed previously, the term tegha seems loosely applied and as with many of these terms, somewhat irrelevant. The term itself I believe may be etymologically a term used for sword blade in Arabic (?) and may have become colloquially used to describe a heavier than usual blade at some point.
A blade as seen on your sword would have indeed seen combat use as it is simply a heavier blade with deeper curve, the dynamics for which I would defer to the martial artists here, but I am sure, was quite effective.

Thank you for sharing your conquest!

and please post the photos when it arrives...maybe there will be some markings!

All best regards,
Jim

Sikh_soldier · 24th January 2008, 11:47 PM

Hello Jim

Thank you very much for a very very informative post, I now not only have a possible source of origin for my recently acquired sword, but also learned of a criteria to help distinguish other pieces later.

Also, thanks for the reference to the book (Indian arms and armour) I will try and locate a copy.

I have also noted from looking at examples of sold tulwars on oriental arms, that tulwars are not usually that curved.
http://www.oriental-arms.co.il/search.php?q=tulwar

Regards
Bally

Jim McDougall · 25th January 2008, 04:35 AM

You're very welcome Bally! By using the search on our forum you will discover an amazing core of knowledge shared by all here, and it constantly grows thanks to you and others who share thier weapons as examples.
The Pant book is typically quite expensive, and I'm not sure if it might be obtainable through interlibrary loan...but may be worth a try. The publish date is 1980, Lahore, and I dont know the ISBN offhand.

Oriental Arms is not only an excellent and reliable source for weapons, but equally so for referencing them (stated as my own personal opinion from personal experience).

Talwars typically carry a relatively shallow curved blade, which in examples from late 18th into the 19th century corresponded more to European cavalry blades. As has been discussed recently on concurrent threads, there are many instances of talwars mounted with British cavalry sabre blades, with the most favored being the British M1796 light cavalry blade.

All very best regards,
Jim

24th January 2008, 06:26 PM	#1
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,193	Hi Bally, I can well understand being anxious and excited when awaiting the arrival of a newly acquired weapon, as I'm sure most of us do, so no worries about impatience OK? The best thing is that you have shared it here with us, and as I mentioned, many of us head for notes and references...just so you know in many ways we are all learning together. You're doing pretty well for a beginner! This is a very nice example, and the noticeable upward curve and widened tip on a heavier than usual blade is what in my perception would allow the 'tegha' term to what would otherwise be considered a standard hilt talwar. You are doing well in noting the spike form pommel rather than the cap or button, which would in my opinion further suggest Rajput attribution. In many cases the curved appendage as seen on the Hindu basket hilt (typically termed 'khanda' or if it has foreign blade 'firangi') has been seen on some tulwars in varied degree, more or less vestigially recalling that feature on these characteristically Rajput swords. We know that they were used by others as well, but that is another discussion. As Ariel has noted, it is very difficult to attribute certain hilts to specific regions with talwars, as well as indeed trying to determine period .Standard forms were used over centuries so relying on subtle element variation and basic 'forensics' is often the only way to suggest possible dating. G.N.Pant in his "Indian Arms and Armour" made a substantial effort in trying to establish a systemic designation of talwar hilts, and while it serves well as a benchmark with varying degree of validity, it would be unlikely to consider it more than a guideline. Your hilt is as you have already surmised, probably Rajput, and quite likely from Rajasthan in the 19th c. These swords were often remounted, and I look forward to seeing better photos when this one arrives. As discussed previously, the term tegha seems loosely applied and as with many of these terms, somewhat irrelevant. The term itself I believe may be etymologically a term used for sword blade in Arabic (?) and may have become colloquially used to describe a heavier than usual blade at some point. A blade as seen on your sword would have indeed seen combat use as it is simply a heavier blade with deeper curve, the dynamics for which I would defer to the martial artists here, but I am sure, was quite effective. Thank you for sharing your conquest! and please post the photos when it arrives...maybe there will be some markings! All best regards, Jim

24th January 2008, 11:47 PM	#2
Sikh_soldier Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 87	Hello Jim Thank you very much for a very very informative post, I now not only have a possible source of origin for my recently acquired sword, but also learned of a criteria to help distinguish other pieces later. Also, thanks for the reference to the book (Indian arms and armour) I will try and locate a copy. I have also noted from looking at examples of sold tulwars on oriental arms, that tulwars are not usually that curved. http://www.oriental-arms.co.il/search.php?q=tulwar Regards Bally

25th January 2008, 04:35 AM	#3
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,193	You're very welcome Bally! By using the search on our forum you will discover an amazing core of knowledge shared by all here, and it constantly grows thanks to you and others who share thier weapons as examples. The Pant book is typically quite expensive, and I'm not sure if it might be obtainable through interlibrary loan...but may be worth a try. The publish date is 1980, Lahore, and I dont know the ISBN offhand. Oriental Arms is not only an excellent and reliable source for weapons, but equally so for referencing them (stated as my own personal opinion from personal experience). Talwars typically carry a relatively shallow curved blade, which in examples from late 18th into the 19th century corresponded more to European cavalry blades. As has been discussed recently on concurrent threads, there are many instances of talwars mounted with British cavalry sabre blades, with the most favored being the British M1796 light cavalry blade. All very best regards, Jim