Question about oiling

Pusaka · 11th December 2007, 02:54 PM

I think the advice of not using too much oil dates to the time in which mineral based oils were not used on keris blades. To my knowledge the oil base was coconut oil with essential oils added. The problem with this oil is that the coconut base can in time go rancid and encourage fungus to grow in the wooden sheath. The digestive enzymes released by the fungus can cause discolouration and damage to the wooden parts of the keris.

I think in ancient times oiling a keris was seen as feeding the blade, remember that many Indonesians believe keris have power.

I remember watching "The ring of fire" on dvd, a scene shot in Indonesia shows some court keris. When the blades have been washed people gather outside the court so that they can wash or even drink some of the water used. They believe that some of the power of the keris will be retained in the water even though it contains arsenic

David · 11th December 2007, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pusaka

I think the advice of not using too much oil dates to the time in which mineral based oils were not used on keris blades. To my knowledge the oil base was coconut oil with essential oils added. The problem with this oil is that the coconut base can in time go rancid and encourage fungus to grow in the wooden sheath. The digestive enzymes released by the fungus can cause discolouration and damage to the wooden parts of the keris.

Good point and very possibly so.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pusaka

I think in ancient times oiling a keris was seen as feeding the blade, remember that many Indonesians believe keris have power.

I'm not Indonesian though i may well be ancient

and i certainly consider oiling my keris to be a "feeding".

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pusaka

I remember watching "The ring of fire" on dvd, a scene shot in Indonesia shows some court keris. When the blades have been washed people gather outside the court so that they can wash or even drink some of the water used. They believe that some of the power of the keris will be retained in the water even though it contains arsenic

Eek! indeed!!! I have been meaning to watch this DVD since it was so kindly loaned to me. Maybe i will give it a spin tonight.

Pusaka · 11th December 2007, 09:15 PM

There is a traditional oil used in Cimande Silat called balur oil. The oil contains a coconut base with herbs added. The oils ingredients are a secret known to a few familys in Cimande village. The interesting thing about this oil is that when the oil is being made mantras are uttered over it to empower the oil.
I have always thought that keris oil may have been made in a similar way. I know that the ingredients and preparation of some keris oils were also secret.

Karttikeya · 11th December 2011, 12:08 PM

Sorry, I raise again this thread because I am interested in Pak Alan's statement "wrap the blade in a plastic sleeve". I think it will trigger new rust if we wrap the blade in plastic sleeve for long term after oiling. Yes, I agree a plastic sleeve is purposed to prevent oil dry out but in other side it will trigger new rust. Usually here, they wrap the blade in plastic sleeve only for temporary after marangi done, maybe more less 1-2 months. After that, just remove the plastic sleeve and oil the blade regularly to preserve the blade.

Jean · 11th December 2011, 01:50 PM

My personal oiling policy is purposely a minimal one and as follows:
Whenever I receive a blade especially after cleaning & warangan, I immediately apply anti-rust oil (3 in 1 brand) on it with a soft brush, let it partly dry for few minutes and wipe it with a cloth or paper towel. After that, it can stay very long without rusting nor tarnishing if you keep the blade in a dry environment (even if it is inserted into its sheath).
If the blade is Javanese (or Madurese/ Balinese in some cases), I apply a good quality pusaka oil (minyak pusaka from kraton Surakarta), let it be adsorbed onto the blade overnight, and wipe the excess with a cloth before putting it back into the sheath. Keeping the oiled blade into a plastic sleeve is a good protection but not mandatory in a dry environment.
Upon inspecting my blades, I repeat the above steps only if required.
Best regards

A. G. Maisey · 11th December 2011, 08:14 PM

Karttikeya, rust attacks ferric material where water is present.

In the ideal situation ferric material should be stored on glass or plastic/perspex shelves in a climate controlled environment, ie, constant temperature, no moisture.

For the usual collector the provision of such environment is not practical, nor possible.

The important thing is this:- keep ferric material out of contact with moisture, and that includes cellulose material, which retains moisture. That means don't let your blades be stored in wood or paper or cloth.

My post # 4 sets forth simply and concisely the methods that I have used over better than 50 years. My methods work. I have blades that I have treated and stored as I describe that have not been re-oiled in better than 20 years. Even 40 odd years ago I was using split plastic bags to wrap blades in, and I still have a couple of these blades in their original wrappings.

Climate is another consideration. I do not live in a tropical climate, but I do live in a maritime climate, I'm less than 25 meters from salt water.

Plastic wrapping of a blade after oiling does work, and most definitely does not generate rust.

But if one does not wish to use plastic, that is not important, what is important is that the blade be protected from contact with moisture. This means that you do not store the unprotected blade in the wrongko, and that you exclude contact with air. This is the purpose of oil:- it excludes air. Plastic wrapping retains the oil.

I have a very great number of blades that need to be protected. I do not have the time to oil each blade every few weeks, thus I try to keep the oil on the blade for as long as possible. Plastic wrap helps to achieve this.

Pusaka · 15th December 2011, 08:03 PM

In Japan don’t they believe using pure clove oil will prevent rusting of the blade?

Personally I don’t like the idea of using synthetic mineral oil on keris, Im sure the isi wont like it

11th December 2007, 02:54 PM	#1
Pusaka Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 341	I think the advice of not using too much oil dates to the time in which mineral based oils were not used on keris blades. To my knowledge the oil base was coconut oil with essential oils added. The problem with this oil is that the coconut base can in time go rancid and encourage fungus to grow in the wooden sheath. The digestive enzymes released by the fungus can cause discolouration and damage to the wooden parts of the keris. I think in ancient times oiling a keris was seen as feeding the blade, remember that many Indonesians believe keris have power. I remember watching "The ring of fire" on dvd, a scene shot in Indonesia shows some court keris. When the blades have been washed people gather outside the court so that they can wash or even drink some of the water used. They believe that some of the power of the keris will be retained in the water even though it contains arsenic

11th December 2007, 09:15 PM	#3
Pusaka Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 341	There is a traditional oil used in Cimande Silat called balur oil. The oil contains a coconut base with herbs added. The oils ingredients are a secret known to a few familys in Cimande village. The interesting thing about this oil is that when the oil is being made mantras are uttered over it to empower the oil. I have always thought that keris oil may have been made in a similar way. I know that the ingredients and preparation of some keris oils were also secret.

11th December 2011, 12:08 PM	#4
Karttikeya Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Posts: 54	Sorry, I raise again this thread because I am interested in Pak Alan's statement "wrap the blade in a plastic sleeve". I think it will trigger new rust if we wrap the blade in plastic sleeve for long term after oiling. Yes, I agree a plastic sleeve is purposed to prevent oil dry out but in other side it will trigger new rust. Usually here, they wrap the blade in plastic sleeve only for temporary after marangi done, maybe more less 1-2 months. After that, just remove the plastic sleeve and oil the blade regularly to preserve the blade.

11th December 2011, 01:50 PM	#5
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	My personal oiling policy is purposely a minimal one and as follows: Whenever I receive a blade especially after cleaning & warangan, I immediately apply anti-rust oil (3 in 1 brand) on it with a soft brush, let it partly dry for few minutes and wipe it with a cloth or paper towel. After that, it can stay very long without rusting nor tarnishing if you keep the blade in a dry environment (even if it is inserted into its sheath). If the blade is Javanese (or Madurese/ Balinese in some cases), I apply a good quality pusaka oil (minyak pusaka from kraton Surakarta), let it be adsorbed onto the blade overnight, and wipe the excess with a cloth before putting it back into the sheath. Keeping the oiled blade into a plastic sleeve is a good protection but not mandatory in a dry environment. Upon inspecting my blades, I repeat the above steps only if required. Best regards

11th December 2011, 08:14 PM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,056	Karttikeya, rust attacks ferric material where water is present. In the ideal situation ferric material should be stored on glass or plastic/perspex shelves in a climate controlled environment, ie, constant temperature, no moisture. For the usual collector the provision of such environment is not practical, nor possible. The important thing is this:- keep ferric material out of contact with moisture, and that includes cellulose material, which retains moisture. That means don't let your blades be stored in wood or paper or cloth. My post # 4 sets forth simply and concisely the methods that I have used over better than 50 years. My methods work. I have blades that I have treated and stored as I describe that have not been re-oiled in better than 20 years. Even 40 odd years ago I was using split plastic bags to wrap blades in, and I still have a couple of these blades in their original wrappings. Climate is another consideration. I do not live in a tropical climate, but I do live in a maritime climate, I'm less than 25 meters from salt water. Plastic wrapping of a blade after oiling does work, and most definitely does not generate rust. But if one does not wish to use plastic, that is not important, what is important is that the blade be protected from contact with moisture. This means that you do not store the unprotected blade in the wrongko, and that you exclude contact with air. This is the purpose of oil:- it excludes air. Plastic wrapping retains the oil. I have a very great number of blades that need to be protected. I do not have the time to oil each blade every few weeks, thus I try to keep the oil on the blade for as long as possible. Plastic wrap helps to achieve this.

15th December 2011, 08:03 PM	#7
Pusaka Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 341	In Japan don’t they believe using pure clove oil will prevent rusting of the blade? Personally I don’t like the idea of using synthetic mineral oil on keris, Im sure the isi wont like it