A foundation for examining the quality of a keris blade

[kai]

Hello Alan,

During more than twenty years of going along to these shows with my bag of keris I never sold one good, old, Javanese keris. Not one.

What would have been the lower end range of keris you consider good & old?

In fact, during all that time not a single potential buyer was sufficiently attracted to the good, old Javanese keris that I had on offer to even pick one up and enquire the price.

I have to admit that this surprised me. It's a safe guess that many beginning collectors are tempted by the more gaudy pieces but not a single collector experienced with old keris in 20 years? Amazing...

Regards,
Kai

[A. G. Maisey]

My attendances at these shows stopped about 6 or 7 years ago, so I cannot recall in detail exactly what I might have offered at any particular show, however, in broad terms, low end would have been something like a Tuban wengkon in Jogja timoho with mamas, high end would have been Kinom , probably in new Solo wrongko with silver. Both blades would have been in a good state of preservation.

Its not so much a matter of:-

"---beginning collectors are tempted by the more gaudy pieces but not a single collector experienced with old keris in 20 years? ---"

Yes, certainly it is possible to offer quite spectacular keris when working with current era material, and when I do offer this type of thing I have invariably offered the very best that I have been able to obtain, within each specific value range, so there would have been a number of keris on display with very high visual and artistic impact. I believe that most collectors based in the western world will invariably be attracted to a keris with a very high level of craftsmanship, combined with good artistic interpretation.

Right alongside these "Playboy Centrefolds" we have two or three old blades with a slightly subdued finish, smaller, thinner, the workmanship when measured by universal craft standards, almost invariably inferior. A Javanese gentleman with considerable experience in keris would recognise what they were. A western collector , even one with 30 or 40 years of experience in keris, all or most of it obtained in the western world, would only see some rather unremarkable old blades. If that western collector had bothered to ask prices, he would probably have died of a heart attack when he learnt that the thin, old , unremarkable blade with wos wutah pamor in worn dress had a ticket that was multiples of the brave, spectacular blade with brilliantly executed pamor ron duru, complete with Solo ladrang, silver pendok, and gem studded selut.

The western based collector has in general, built his collection on quality craftsmanship, art, and value for money.

The collector in Jawa has in general, built his collection on cultural values which apply within Jawa, but are for the most part not recognised outside Jawa.

One set of standards is not superior to the other, within the societal context where they exist.

David, I recognise your advice as an attempt to prevent a fire before it occurs. I assure you, for my part, I will be adding no fuel to any little flames that may happen to arise. However, in order to answer Kai's question in a manner that would not mislead, I have found it necessary to expand as I have done above.

[David]

That's OK Alan. I don't see your reply as "fuel for the fire". In fact i believe the point you are trying to make is crucial to the original question of the thread. How do we appraise the value of a keris when different standards and collecting approaches exist not only between East and West (the most obvious), but also within the Indonesian culture frame itself? Ganja talks about the differences between Surakarta and Yogyakarta, but surely standards are even wider apart between, say, Surakarta and Terangganu. Then, of course, there is always a matter of simple personal preferences. Though much of what we like is influenced by our particular cultures there will always be those certain things that appeal on an individual basis.
I personally do not tend towards the general Western mold in my keris collection. I must admit that i do like to look at the "centerfolds", but i ask myself, do i really want one for my wife? To tell the truth i do have a couple in my collection that i got based on looks alone, but most of my collection is made up of older blades, not so much of the "high end" ones of which Alan speaks, but still, in my personal assessment, respectable blades...with "personality". I do understand the general Western desire for glamor and high levels of craftsmanship in their blades, but for me it is not the most important aspect for collection. That the keris "speaks" to me is far more important. Of course, since i rarely get to handle the keris i buy beforehand this can be a bit of a gamble. But i feel i have done remarkable well with this and i'm usual very pleased with my purchases once in hand. I think this could be due in part to the fact that i make most of my purchases from people i know who in turn have a good sense of my own personal tastes.

[kai]

Hello Alan,

in broad terms, low end would have been something like a Tuban wengkon in Jogja timoho with mamas, high end would have been Kinom , probably in new Solo wrongko with silver. Both blades would have been in a good state of preservation.

So these would start in the price range of a smaller 2nd hand car (in good state of preservation )?

BTW, what's the concept of an "old" keris (blade) in Jawa?

A Javanese gentleman with considerable experience in keris would recognise what they were. A western collector , even one with 30 or 40 years of experience in keris, all or most of it obtained in the western world, would only see some rather unremarkable old blades.

So this boils down to wether one has a firm understanding of the tangguh system or not?

Regards,
Kai