Oman Jambiya For Comments

Conogre · 26th February 2005, 03:04 PM

Here's a few photos of the smaller Wahabite dagger...this is where my confusion came in as I thought this was the Saudi Arabian style.
Mike

derek · 26th February 2005, 05:00 PM

Hi Conogre,

I have one identical to this. This exact style is noted as a "dharia, known as rashaq" of the bani (family) Shahr and bani Malik in Saudi. This again, is from Weapons of the Islamic World, published by the King Faisal Centre for Research and Islamic Studies. There are many variations of these styles in the Arabian peninsula and it's probably better to think in terms of tribal/family associtations rather than countries and regions.

Conogre · 26th February 2005, 07:36 PM

Thank you for the information.
The smaller one is 13 1/2", while my larger one is 19", my being fortunate enough to get the pair together.
Do you have any idea where I could obtain a copy of this literature on the Arabic knives?
As is so often the case, so much is lost when something becomes anglicized, going from a treasure to "just a thing".
Mike

derek · 26th February 2005, 09:18 PM

Well, the book I am referring to was first made known to me by a Jordanian antique dealer in the UAE. It is sold through the Centre for Research in Riyadh. I went there on a business trip (shortly before things started getting crazy there) and with the help of a lebanese colleague I got a large box of them and brought them home in my suitcase. Several forumites bought all the extras, and I was trying to get more at one point. However, all my friends in Riyadh have left and my arabic isn't good enough to get a deal done over the phone. So, if anyone wants to pursue it, I say please do -- and share them!
-d

ariel · 26th February 2005, 11:04 PM

I have this book: a lot of pretty pictures but abysmally low academic level. Reference to "Mogul Kalatchori swords" (p.44) doesn't explain what on Earth they are. several Saudi Arabian jambiyas (pp. 57-63) show blades of alleged Muayyar,Beyd,Nafihi,Shbeyl, Zabidi,Qabwa, and Baydawi styles also without any definitions, an Afghani Pesh Kabz p.98) is defined as Moghul etc.
By the way, one of the sponsors for the book (1991) was Bin Ladin Saudi Group.
Gives one pause....

derek · 27th February 2005, 04:02 AM

Fyi, Bin Laden Group has companies doing all sorts of things all over the world, but especially ALL over the middle east. Most major construction projects bear the name, and its in print or on signs pretty much everywhere you look.

This book is very light on information, but after all its really just a catalog of a gallery exhibit in Riyadh. What makes it interesting is that it, like Islamic Swords and Swordsmiths, is a book written locally but in english. And how many other books offer 100%, full color photos?

ariel · 27th February 2005, 06:39 AM

Yes, I know it was not Osama himself who funded the publication.
Some time ago we had a heated discussion about Tirri's book (also essentially a catalog of private collection).Compared to the Saudi collection of full page color pictures, Tirri's one was an academic masterpiece!
For me the two books by Astvatsaturyan (on Caucasian and Turkish weapons) are the gold standard. Pity they are not available in English! What about Elgood's books on Arabian and Indian weapons? Van Zonnenweld's on Indonesian weapons? Gutowski's book on Tatar weapons? Chodynski's on Persian weapons?
It IS possible to publish a first rate book combining both academic rigor and good pictures: all is needed is a combination of a reasonably generous publisher and a dedicated academically-oriented researcher. No millions from Bin Ladin and his ilk can compensate for the writer's appaling lack of professionalism.

26th February 2005, 03:04 PM	#1
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	Here's a few photos of the smaller Wahabite dagger...this is where my confusion came in as I thought this was the Saudi Arabian style. Mike Attached Images

26th February 2005, 05:00 PM	#2
derek Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 215	Hi Conogre, I have one identical to this. This exact style is noted as a "dharia, known as rashaq" of the bani (family) Shahr and bani Malik in Saudi. This again, is from Weapons of the Islamic World, published by the King Faisal Centre for Research and Islamic Studies. There are many variations of these styles in the Arabian peninsula and it's probably better to think in terms of tribal/family associtations rather than countries and regions.

26th February 2005, 07:36 PM	#3
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	Thank you for the information. The smaller one is 13 1/2", while my larger one is 19", my being fortunate enough to get the pair together. Do you have any idea where I could obtain a copy of this literature on the Arabic knives? As is so often the case, so much is lost when something becomes anglicized, going from a treasure to "just a thing". Mike

26th February 2005, 09:18 PM	#4
derek Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 215	Well, the book I am referring to was first made known to me by a Jordanian antique dealer in the UAE. It is sold through the Centre for Research in Riyadh. I went there on a business trip (shortly before things started getting crazy there) and with the help of a lebanese colleague I got a large box of them and brought them home in my suitcase. Several forumites bought all the extras, and I was trying to get more at one point. However, all my friends in Riyadh have left and my arabic isn't good enough to get a deal done over the phone. So, if anyone wants to pursue it, I say please do -- and share them! -d

26th February 2005, 11:04 PM	#5
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	I have this book: a lot of pretty pictures but abysmally low academic level. Reference to "Mogul Kalatchori swords" (p.44) doesn't explain what on Earth they are. several Saudi Arabian jambiyas (pp. 57-63) show blades of alleged Muayyar,Beyd,Nafihi,Shbeyl, Zabidi,Qabwa, and Baydawi styles also without any definitions, an Afghani Pesh Kabz p.98) is defined as Moghul etc. By the way, one of the sponsors for the book (1991) was Bin Ladin Saudi Group. Gives one pause....

27th February 2005, 04:02 AM	#6
derek Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 215	Fyi, Bin Laden Group has companies doing all sorts of things all over the world, but especially ALL over the middle east. Most major construction projects bear the name, and its in print or on signs pretty much everywhere you look. This book is very light on information, but after all its really just a catalog of a gallery exhibit in Riyadh. What makes it interesting is that it, like Islamic Swords and Swordsmiths, is a book written locally but in english. And how many other books offer 100%, full color photos?

27th February 2005, 06:39 AM	#7
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Yes, I know it was not Osama himself who funded the publication. Some time ago we had a heated discussion about Tirri's book (also essentially a catalog of private collection).Compared to the Saudi collection of full page color pictures, Tirri's one was an academic masterpiece! For me the two books by Astvatsaturyan (on Caucasian and Turkish weapons) are the gold standard. Pity they are not available in English! What about Elgood's books on Arabian and Indian weapons? Van Zonnenweld's on Indonesian weapons? Gutowski's book on Tatar weapons? Chodynski's on Persian weapons? It IS possible to publish a first rate book combining both academic rigor and good pictures: all is needed is a combination of a reasonably generous publisher and a dedicated academically-oriented researcher. No millions from Bin Ladin and his ilk can compensate for the writer's appaling lack of professionalism.