Borneo ?? Sumatra ??

[Dajak]

Murut

[Rick]

I tell you Dajak this Borneo/Sulu/Mindanao Moro line seems very blurred.
In a lot of ways the blade on the subject piece of this thread reminds me of a Bangkung.

Sometimes I wonder if we will ever be able to sort it all out .

[Ian]

Rick:

IIRC bangkung is a Sulawesi term, at least that is how it appears to be characterized in v. Zonneveld. The blade form, however, is quite widespread -- from Sumatra to Borneo to Mindanao, as well as Sulawesi. In the Philippines, Cato states that the bangkung is mainly a weapon of the Yakan on Basilan. However, this blade form is seen quite commonly on Lumad swords of the Bagobo/Kaolu, while the ginunting of Negros Occidental (Visayas) also has some similarity to a bangkung.

Ian

[Dajak]

Hi Ian

For us from overseas in the Netherlands we call all the Philipinne krissen Sundang moro krissen or moro kris
sorry for that


Don t keep the Zonneveld book to much as a reference on Borneo Items because he made a few mistakes in it that I already discussed with him .

HE DID PUT WITH THE JIMPULS AN BLADE THAT IS NOT AN JIMPUL .
I ASK HIM WHY YOU DO THIS HIS ;

...... ANSWER WAS I COULD NOT FIND ANY DOCUMENTATION ON THIS TYPE OFF SWORD ........

So in my opinnion do things like this is wrong .

The problem with this now that some one with an blade form like pic 165 on page 57 thinks he have an Jimpul.




regards Ben

[VVV]

I disagree a bit on some things that Ben brings up even if I agree with his other statements.
First I don't think that the parang from Nieuwenhuis is that close in style (first picture attached).
Then I don't agree that f.i. searching the Leiden archives clearly proves that this sword is from Borneo? I have attached two pictures, the first collected on Borneo and the second in Jambi.
There was a lot of migration in this region. If we can agree on that this isn't a Dayak sword, but Malay, then it could either have been brought to Borneo when somebody from Sumatra moved to Borneo?
I assume that when people moved around between the islands they brought with them their weapons?
Or it could have been produced in Borneo by a blademaker who had moved from Sumatra to Borneo?
Does that make it a Borneo sword???
Is it the style or where it was produced that decides the origin?
Is a balisong made by a Filipino in LA, in a traditional Filipino style, an American knife?
The braiding I also think was made on Borneo. Depending on the scenarios it could have been made later or when produced.

Michael

PS Ben, I wanted to see the part of the blade closest to the tip.

[Dajak]

Hi Michael I agree that it is not an Dayak sword but
with a lot off things that produced in Borneo like the hilt off The batak look like weapons was produced in Brunei the blade mostly from european swords

The same with the parang nabur made in malaysia but also on Borneo

[Dajak]

Sorry forgot to send it