My first Moro Kris stain attempt

[Gt Obach]

i remember that awhile back there was a post on renew the pattern on these blades.... I believe it was something with arsenic trioxide and lime juice......
-- think thats the more traditional way?

I agree with Ric.... don't mix the acids..... acetic and ferric chloride may make it muddy... just the acetic should be fine and it may take abit....since it's a very weak acid... .

also... can you remove the handle..... don't want any acid on that...
& don't forget to neutralize it
- positively degrease it before any attempt at an etch...
- also... full emersion of blade in etchant is the best... ( at least from my experience )

take care
Greg

[David]

Hi Greg. Arsenic and lime (warangan) is the traditional manner of staining Indonesian keris. It is not used, AFAIK to bring out patterns in Moro kris (it is not a fast rule, but the tendency on this forum is the spelling keris=Indonesian/kris=Moro).
Handles can be removed from Moro kris, but it is much more involved than it is with the Indo keris. Personally i would wrap plastic wrap really tightly around the hilt before working. Brushing on warm vinegar is pretty effective on kris. It is slow acting and easy to control. If you keep the vinegar moving you can get good, even results.
Full imersion is a good way to go, but not really necessary. I have also stained Indo keris with warangan and i use the brush method using a soft toothbrush. I have gotten very good results.
Your advice that the blades be degreased first and neutralized after is excellent advice indeed.

[kai]

Brushing on warm vinegar is pretty effective on kris. It is slow acting and easy to control. If you keep the vinegar moving you can get good, even results.
Full imersion is a good way to go, but not really necessary.

Yes. If the etching is not strong enough to your tastes, ramp up the temperature (vinegar and blade) first - that's usually sufficient for good results.

Regards,
Kai

[Bill M]

Will see about getting the stain I just put on removed. Should I try polishing? Or something else that will chemically remove it?



As I am cleaning and polishing the blade it seems as if the kris enjoys this attention. Weird, huh?

Also likes, especially, to be stroked from the hilt to the tip. I have heard other people tell me thsi is the proper way to polish a kris, and it really seems right.

It is a similar feeling I get when petting my dogs. Feels good to me and feels good to them.

Well, I will gte on thos later. Got to get to work, now.

Thanks for the help. Will share smome more pictures tonight.

[Gt Obach]

thank you David

my bad
glad you set me straight on the etch... (its definitely not my area as i'm a wootz man )

however i really love the patternwelds on these kinds of blades..... i don't post on them because i'm very lost on the language and descriptions...

by the way... the blade looks to be made of bloom steel... i've hammer welded some steel from wrought iron (wrought being a processed bloom steel) ... and after it is etched, will have very similar surface pattern...... it is really apparent as you polish because you will notice small inclusions in the steel (which are silicous slags from the original bloom ).... this is not the same as welding flaws...

take care
Greg

ps... more pic's please

[kai]

Will see about getting the stain I just put on removed. Should I try polishing?

Yes, I'd go for slight repolishing - probably very little effort needed. This will result in crisp staining. (Make sure to remove any traces of oils/chemicals/whatever afterwards: a clean blade is a very decisive factor for etching as Greg already pointed out.)

Soaking a blade in cool vinegar often removes prior stains but, due to the more etched surface, can result in less "crisp" staining.

Regards,
Kai

[kai]

Is it just me or do others think as well that this might be a really nice kris from one of the Lumad groups? From my observations, the carvings at the gangya area appear atypical for Moro designs. Especially the weird file work around the "elephant/eagle mouth" as well as the rather short & stubby other side of the gangya seem to be more consistent with other Lumad examples.

Could someone of the more knowledgeable folks comment on the hilt carvings, please? Any hints here?

BTW, Bill, can you ascertain that the gangya is separate?

Regards,
Kai

[Bill]

Originally Posted by kai

Is it just me or do others think as well that this might be a really nice kris from one of the Lumad groups? From my observations, the carvings at the gangya area appear atypical for Moro designs. Especially the weird file work around the "elephant/eagle mouth" as well as the rather short & stubby other side of the gangya seem to be more consistent with other Lumad examples.

Regards,
Kai

Be nice for a smith to reply on this one. My guess is that "elephant" is usually worked into rough form by the smith & finished with file work. This one looks like it was made blank & the entire "elephant" is file work.

[Bill M]

Originally Posted by kai

Is it just me or do others think as well that this might be a really nice kris from one of the Lumad groups? From my observations, the carvings at the gangya area appear atypical for Moro designs. Especially the weird file work around the "elephant/eagle mouth" as well as the rather short & stubby other side of the gangya seem to be more consistent with other Lumad examples.

Could someone of the more knowledgeable folks comment on the hilt carvings, please? Any hints here?

BTW, Bill, can you ascertain that the gangya is separate?

Regards,
Kai

Kia,

I would really like to know more about this piece. The ganga IS separate. I also have a scabbard that looks like the handle carving. Unfortunately the scabbard is brokena nd has pieces missing.

I did re-stain it tonight, but forgot about heating the blade first, so the stain did not work very well. Cleaned and neutralized it (baking sods?), rinsed and dried it carefully. Will work on it some more tomorrow night.

Bill