Keris for comment

David · 2nd October 2006, 02:15 PM

LOL!!!

Lew, i think i'm a bit like you. Sometimes when i contact these guys they actually are thankful because they didn't really know any better. Sometimes you get a guy like this, who really does know but wants to pretend otherwise. I actually had a rather detailed back and forth with this guy over this very keris the LAST time he tried to sell this piece of crap. He basically assured me it was not only the real deal, but a very powerful JAVANESE keris according to his own knowledgeable Javanese friends. So powerful that when he took it out to show them the guy's wife had to leave the room.

He told me that he would bet me $4000 (to the charity of my choice) if i was correct, but of course he is not willing to put it to the test. I challenged him to post it here and i think it is funny that it found it's way here afterall.

Yes, i think "keris-like object" desribes this item best. To actually call it a keris is an insult to a great art and culture.

Alam Shah · 2nd October 2006, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

LOL!!!

... He basically assured me it was not only the real deal, but a very powerful JAVANESE keris according to his own knowledgeable Javanese friends. So powerful that when he took it out to show them the guy's wife had to leave the room.

Probably the wiser wife was thinking... what a piece of crap...

[QUOTE=David]He told me that he would bet me $4000 (to the charity of my choice) if i was correct, but of course he is not willing to put it to the test. I challenged him to post it here and i think it is funny that it found it's way here afterall.

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

Yes, i think "keris-like object" desribes this item best.

A nicer and polite way of describing the item.

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

To actually call it a keris is an insult to a great art and culture.

Precisely. If this is the quality of keris, I guess we'll be off collecting other stuffs.

Fortunately, it is not. So here we are commenting and discussing, as usual.

Lew · 2nd October 2006, 06:45 PM

Hi Guys

I think the seller must either be delusional,totally gullable or just down right full of roo dung or maybe this really what he sees when he looks his keris

They are almost identical you know

I will be emailing a link to the seller so dave I think he had better get his check book ready I know a few good charities he can send the money to

Btw Dave you must be the person who he is talking about in this emal.

For some inexplicable reason the posting of this auction seems to have attracted a stream of comments which would be laughable if they weren't so pathetic. (I'm guessing that you are either a colleague or perhaps the same person as some imbecile who keeps telling me that this 40+ year old authenticated keris is a fake, but who when challenged to put his money where his mouth is died like a pricked balloon). You have my permission to post a picture of this item wherever you wish. In the meantime, a local collector who DOES know what he is talking about is close to consummating purchase of this excellent item.

Lew

David · 2nd October 2006, 08:14 PM

Yeah Lew, i am afraid i would be that very same "imbecile"

I should have taken hiom up on his wager, but i figured it was a waste of time and he would never pay in the end.
In his last post to me he writes:
You may recall that I made the following offer to you:
When the keris was still within my possession, I would send the physical item (at my expense) to any acknowledged expert, provided we both posted a bond (payable to charity) to ensure I wasn't wasting my time. You (predictably) chickened out, but now you want me to go and look at some blog that is no doubt heavily loaded with your friends and relations. You should ask yourself who am I more likely to believe - a native Indonesian who has a deep understanding of the keris and a knowledgeable collector, or some peanut who has read one or two books and who thinks a forged pattern is paint!! If you appraise yourself honestly you will realise that you have heavily negative credibility.

Alan, i think the "peanut" he is referring to is you.

David · 2nd October 2006, 08:19 PM

Hey Lew, sorry, but i edited this guy's ID from your post. I think it is probably best that way.

Rick · 2nd October 2006, 08:22 PM

Let's try to refrain from casting aspersions upon the Seller .
I know that this has been lively and entertaining; but one thing can often lead to another .
I would hate to see this escalate.

I gave up trying to educate Sellers some few years ago .

David · 2nd October 2006, 08:39 PM

Rick is right. Let's keep it civil, even with this absent ebay dealer.

It's always a toss-up for me when i see inaccuracies on ebay whether or not i make contact. Sometimes the sellers have been very receptive, but then you get a response like this. I contacted another guy just recently about Moro weapons and it turns out that his dad has a storefont right across the river from me that i never knew existed loaded with Philippines blades. We had a great face to face and i showed them how to ID the newer stuff and they were very grateful and i now have a new source to hit every now and then. So sometimes it works out well for everyone.

I think this guy is beyond anyone's help and we should just move on.

A. G. Maisey · 2nd October 2006, 10:47 PM

I'm actually rather partial to peanuts, David. Probably eat about half a kilo a week of them, washed down with Perrier sometimes, other times with a decent Shiraz. I think in an emegency I could just about live on peanuts.Peanuts and Shiraz, not peanuts and Perrier. Gotta get your fruit somehow.

If this gentleman was referring to me, well, maybe he`s right. All those peanuts over so many years gotta have some sort effect.

I believe this gentleman is located in Perth.

I know a lady living near Perth who is a student of the keris and who has a reasonable level of knowledge.

There is also an Indonesian fellow who runs a business selling goloks and similar things that are made in Bandung. This fellow also knows a little bit about the keris.

If this seller truly wishes to learn what it is he is offering for sale, I dare say I could put him in touch with these people.

If he does not wish to learn, well perhaps he would be wise to beat a strategic retreat and wait a year or so before listing this object again.

2nd October 2006, 06:45 PM	#3
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	Hi Guys I think the seller must either be delusional,totally gullable or just down right full of roo dung or maybe this really what he sees when he looks his keris They are almost identical you know I will be emailing a link to the seller so dave I think he had better get his check book ready I know a few good charities he can send the money to Btw Dave you must be the person who he is talking about in this emal. For some inexplicable reason the posting of this auction seems to have attracted a stream of comments which would be laughable if they weren't so pathetic. (I'm guessing that you are either a colleague or perhaps the same person as some imbecile who keeps telling me that this 40+ year old authenticated keris is a fake, but who when challenged to put his money where his mouth is died like a pricked balloon). You have my permission to post a picture of this item wherever you wish. In the meantime, a local collector who DOES know what he is talking about is close to consummating purchase of this excellent item. Lew Attached Images Last edited by David; 2nd October 2006 at 08:17 PM. Reason: Best to keep identities out of this i think

2nd October 2006, 08:19 PM	#5
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	Hey Lew, sorry, but i edited this guy's ID from your post. I think it is probably best that way. Last edited by David; 3rd October 2006 at 12:25 AM.

2nd October 2006, 08:22 PM	#6
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,336	Fellas Let's try to refrain from casting aspersions upon the Seller . I know that this has been lively and entertaining; but one thing can often lead to another . I would hate to see this escalate. I gave up trying to educate Sellers some few years ago .

2nd October 2006, 02:15 PM	#1
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	LOL!!! Lew, i think i'm a bit like you. Sometimes when i contact these guys they actually are thankful because they didn't really know any better. Sometimes you get a guy like this, who really does know but wants to pretend otherwise. I actually had a rather detailed back and forth with this guy over this very keris the LAST time he tried to sell this piece of crap. He basically assured me it was not only the real deal, but a very powerful JAVANESE keris according to his own knowledgeable Javanese friends. So powerful that when he took it out to show them the guy's wife had to leave the room. He told me that he would bet me $4000 (to the charity of my choice) if i was correct, but of course he is not willing to put it to the test. I challenged him to post it here and i think it is funny that it found it's way here afterall. Yes, i think "keris-like object" desribes this item best. To actually call it a keris is an insult to a great art and culture.

2nd October 2006, 08:14 PM	#4
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	Yeah Lew, i am afraid i would be that very same "imbecile" I should have taken hiom up on his wager, but i figured it was a waste of time and he would never pay in the end. In his last post to me he writes: You may recall that I made the following offer to you: When the keris was still within my possession, I would send the physical item (at my expense) to any acknowledged expert, provided we both posted a bond (payable to charity) to ensure I wasn't wasting my time. You (predictably) chickened out, but now you want me to go and look at some blog that is no doubt heavily loaded with your friends and relations. You should ask yourself who am I more likely to believe - a native Indonesian who has a deep understanding of the keris and a knowledgeable collector, or some peanut who has read one or two books and who thinks a forged pattern is paint!! If you appraise yourself honestly you will realise that you have heavily negative credibility. Alan, i think the "peanut" he is referring to is you.

2nd October 2006, 08:39 PM	#7
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	Rick is right. Let's keep it civil, even with this absent ebay dealer. It's always a toss-up for me when i see inaccuracies on ebay whether or not i make contact. Sometimes the sellers have been very receptive, but then you get a response like this. I contacted another guy just recently about Moro weapons and it turns out that his dad has a storefont right across the river from me that i never knew existed loaded with Philippines blades. We had a great face to face and i showed them how to ID the newer stuff and they were very grateful and i now have a new source to hit every now and then. So sometimes it works out well for everyone. I think this guy is beyond anyone's help and we should just move on.

2nd October 2006, 10:47 PM	#8
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,992	I'm actually rather partial to peanuts, David. Probably eat about half a kilo a week of them, washed down with Perrier sometimes, other times with a decent Shiraz. I think in an emegency I could just about live on peanuts.Peanuts and Shiraz, not peanuts and Perrier. Gotta get your fruit somehow. If this gentleman was referring to me, well, maybe he`s right. All those peanuts over so many years gotta have some sort effect. I believe this gentleman is located in Perth. I know a lady living near Perth who is a student of the keris and who has a reasonable level of knowledge. There is also an Indonesian fellow who runs a business selling goloks and similar things that are made in Bandung. This fellow also knows a little bit about the keris. If this seller truly wishes to learn what it is he is offering for sale, I dare say I could put him in touch with these people. If he does not wish to learn, well perhaps he would be wise to beat a strategic retreat and wait a year or so before listing this object again.