Madura Wrongko's of Various Types?

Naga Sasra · 23rd September 2006, 04:05 PM

Mamas Sandang Walikats.

The problem with attributions is, a large percentage of them are inaccurate in nature, that be weather from published Keris literature and most often from sales catalogs, including those from the larger specialty auction houses.

That said, your logical explanation of the Maduran artistic template is well taken, and I for one would tend to agree with your post and certainly honor the opinion of the very well known collector from Malang.

Attached a few more. One highly carved wrongko is quite common and of very recent make, the second one is more of a question mark, and I would really like the forums opinion on this one??

David · 23rd September 2006, 04:45 PM

That first modern example is quite nice. The Madurese knack for wood carving doesn't seem to have diminished much over the years.

That second one is a puzzler. I can't say i have seen this style of sheath from either Jawa or Madura before. To my eye it is more like a cross between Bugis and Madurese forms. The pendok looks more Javanese to me though. Hopefully other will know better than i.

Alam Shah · 23rd September 2006, 05:22 PM

A similar wrangka... (ignore the fittings), what do you think.

Naga Sasra · 23rd September 2006, 09:34 PM

Yes, the Madurese has not lost their flair for wood carving and even though this is a decorative wrongko most likely made for the tourist trade, they tend to apply that unmistakable level of workmanship.

As for the second one, it certainly look like Shahrial's wrongko is from the very same culture, one thing noticeable is both of them have a pendok in the Yogya/Central Javanese older style with the top edge arched.

Shahrial, do you know the origin of the wrongko on your piece?

Alam Shah · 24th September 2006, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Naga Sasra

... wrongko is from the very same culture, one thing noticeable is both of them have a pendok in the Yogya/Central Javanese older style with the top edge arched.

Shahrial, do you know the origin of the wrongko on your piece?

Unfortunately, I do not know either.

General discussions amongst local collectors had pointed in the direction of Pesisir, Java North Coast region.

Naga Sasra · 24th September 2006, 03:22 AM

I just read the entire thread from post number #1, if we look at post #9 the last two photos, look at the wrongko, imagine it without the leaf and flower carving.

Now is it my imagination, or is this wrongko formed just like the one from Alam Shah and mine as well?

A. G. Maisey · 24th September 2006, 09:47 PM

Yes, to me, these three wrongkos look to have the same form.

Alam Shah`s and Erik`s examples look to have Jogja style pendoks.

The pendok on mine could be interpreted as Madura, or could be interpreted as generic Javanese.

I don`t think there is any doubt that the carving on my example is Madurese, and this carving is fairly old. The wrongko itself was bought in Aeng Tong-Tong, and was very dirty when purchased.

Because of where it was purchased, the person from whom it was purchased, and the condition when purchased, along with the unmistakably Madurese carving, I have always been inclined to accept this as another variation in Madura style, however, in light of these other two examples, maybe it is not.

At this point, my inclination is pend the Madura attribution and begin looking at old examples of known origin and provenance, which means pieces in old European collections.

North Coast Jawa has been suggested.
In my (20th century) experience, there is considerable overlap between North Coast Jawa, East Jawa, and Madura---and again between East Jawa and West Bali.

I have in mind a North Coast type of wrongko that does in fact have a rather squarish profile. Perhaps a closer look at this type may suggest something.

This presentation of three examples has highlighted one of the problems of identifying origin of all parts which go to make a complete keris. As soon as we move away from the influence of a Kraton, it appears that what we often find is a mix and match situation, and this mixing and matching is not exclusive to dealers. I recently had the opportunity to provide an opinion on an old keris of known point of collection , and collected in the early 1940's.It had been the keris of a village headman. It was a mixture of Bugis, Palembang, home-made repairs and substitutions, and a wrongko atasan that could have been from any one of many places. It was collected in Sumatra.

With keris, things do not always follow textbook examples.

A. G. Maisey · 28th November 2018, 12:58 AM

Here is one of my long time favourites that escaped from captivity a couple of weeks back.

This form has a lot of variations, they were usually carved by the person who owned the keris, not kraton wear, but rural village use and a form of folk art.

The motif is a personal choice and is normally some sort of flower or leaf or vine type motif.

23rd September 2006, 05:22 PM	#3
Alam Shah Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,248	A similar wrangka... (ignore the fittings), what do you think. Attached Images

28th November 2018, 12:58 AM	#8
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	Here is one of my long time favourites that escaped from captivity a couple of weeks back. This form has a lot of variations, they were usually carved by the person who owned the keris, not kraton wear, but rural village use and a form of folk art. The motif is a personal choice and is normally some sort of flower or leaf or vine type motif. Attached Images

23rd September 2006, 04:05 PM	#1
Naga Sasra Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Boca Raton, Florida, USA Posts: 108	Mamas Sandang Walikats. The problem with attributions is, a large percentage of them are inaccurate in nature, that be weather from published Keris literature and most often from sales catalogs, including those from the larger specialty auction houses. That said, your logical explanation of the Maduran artistic template is well taken, and I for one would tend to agree with your post and certainly honor the opinion of the very well known collector from Malang. Attached a few more. One highly carved wrongko is quite common and of very recent make, the second one is more of a question mark, and I would really like the forums opinion on this one?? Attached Images

23rd September 2006, 04:45 PM	#2
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,218	That first modern example is quite nice. The Madurese knack for wood carving doesn't seem to have diminished much over the years. That second one is a puzzler. I can't say i have seen this style of sheath from either Jawa or Madura before. To my eye it is more like a cross between Bugis and Madurese forms. The pendok looks more Javanese to me though. Hopefully other will know better than i.

23rd September 2006, 09:34 PM	#4
Naga Sasra Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Boca Raton, Florida, USA Posts: 108	Yes, the Madurese has not lost their flair for wood carving and even though this is a decorative wrongko most likely made for the tourist trade, they tend to apply that unmistakable level of workmanship. As for the second one, it certainly look like Shahrial's wrongko is from the very same culture, one thing noticeable is both of them have a pendok in the Yogya/Central Javanese older style with the top edge arched. Shahrial, do you know the origin of the wrongko on your piece?

24th September 2006, 03:22 AM	#6
Naga Sasra Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Boca Raton, Florida, USA Posts: 108	I just read the entire thread from post number #1, if we look at post #9 the last two photos, look at the wrongko, imagine it without the leaf and flower carving. Now is it my imagination, or is this wrongko formed just like the one from Alam Shah and mine as well?

24th September 2006, 09:47 PM	#7
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	Yes, to me, these three wrongkos look to have the same form. Alam Shah`s and Erik`s examples look to have Jogja style pendoks. The pendok on mine could be interpreted as Madura, or could be interpreted as generic Javanese. I don`t think there is any doubt that the carving on my example is Madurese, and this carving is fairly old. The wrongko itself was bought in Aeng Tong-Tong, and was very dirty when purchased. Because of where it was purchased, the person from whom it was purchased, and the condition when purchased, along with the unmistakably Madurese carving, I have always been inclined to accept this as another variation in Madura style, however, in light of these other two examples, maybe it is not. At this point, my inclination is pend the Madura attribution and begin looking at old examples of known origin and provenance, which means pieces in old European collections. North Coast Jawa has been suggested. In my (20th century) experience, there is considerable overlap between North Coast Jawa, East Jawa, and Madura---and again between East Jawa and West Bali. I have in mind a North Coast type of wrongko that does in fact have a rather squarish profile. Perhaps a closer look at this type may suggest something. This presentation of three examples has highlighted one of the problems of identifying origin of all parts which go to make a complete keris. As soon as we move away from the influence of a Kraton, it appears that what we often find is a mix and match situation, and this mixing and matching is not exclusive to dealers. I recently had the opportunity to provide an opinion on an old keris of known point of collection , and collected in the early 1940's.It had been the keris of a village headman. It was a mixture of Bugis, Palembang, home-made repairs and substitutions, and a wrongko atasan that could have been from any one of many places. It was collected in Sumatra. With keris, things do not always follow textbook examples.