Marked Sundanese Pisau Raut: Galuh-Pajajaran?

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by Ian

Is this actually a pisau raut (rattan knife)?

Hi Ian,

This knife has nothing to do with the side knife from a mandau!

Regards,
Detlef

[Ian]

Originally Posted by Sajen

Hi Ian,

This knife has nothing to do with the side knife from a mandau!

Regards,
Detlef

Thanks Detlef. Yes, I understand that there are other forms of pisau raut, but I have not seen one before of this blade shape or that has been etched in this manner. The etching seems to have led to quite a lot of delamination.

Ian.

[naturalist]

I do have few dozens of "pisau raut", this one is in the original forms, it wasn't a result of etching. If i am not mistaken at least i have 2 or three with similar shape, with a little differences on the shape of the integral bolster. Will post in the future all of the forms of the knives that i have at home. Pisau raut and badik in villages in west part of Java (West Java to Banten) rarely applied with warang even though the knives are pattern welded. I do have really nice pamor badik but covered with thick "misik" oil. Fragrant sticky oil. Even many of my old goloks are covered with misik oil.

Originally Posted by Ian

Thanks Detlef. Yes, I understand that there are other forms of pisau raut, but I have not seen one before of this blade shape or that has been etched in this manner. The etching seems to have led to quite a lot of delamination.

Ian.

[Ren Ren]

Originally Posted by Sajen

Hi Ian,

This knife has nothing to do with the side knife from a mandau!

Regards,
Detlef

I completely agree!

[A. G. Maisey]

There are a couple of things that tell us exactly what a pisau raut is, the first is that in Malay languages the purpose to which something is put will often, perhaps usually, give it its name, it can be one thing in the garden, another thing in the house. One thing for one person, a different thing for a different person. Malay, Javanese, Basa Indonesia --- which is a form of Malay --- are to a high degree, situational languages. Thus the idea that a single name is sufficient for any & all objects of a similar form is a pretty silly idea.

Ian is very close to the mark.

Then we have the dictionary meaning of the words:-

pisau = knife

raut in BI means shape or form, and it is a root word, addition of prefixes and suffixes provides other words. When we combine pisau & raut we get pisau raut & that means a knife that is used to give shape to something, it can be a knife used for whittling, a knife used for carving, a knife used for smoothing. It can be a knife used for sharpening pencils.For example, a pensil sharpener is a rautan.


if we wish to understand another society or culture or the things that they produce, the first thing we need to do is learn the language. It helps one hell of a lot.

[naturalist]

thank you so much Sir

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

There are a couple of things that tell us exactly what a pisau raut is, the first is that in Malay languages the purpose to which something is put will often, perhaps usually, give it its name, it can be one thing in the garden, another thing in the house. One thing for one person, a different thing for a different person. Malay, Javanese, Basa Indonesia --- which is a form of Malay --- are to a high degree, situational languages. Thus the idea that a single name is sufficient for any & all objects of a similar form is a pretty silly idea.

Ian is very close to the mark.

Then we have the dictionary meaning of the words:-

pisau = knife

raut in BI means shape or form, and it is a root word, addition of prefixes and suffixes provides other words. When we combine pisau & raut we get pisau raut & that means a knife that is used to give shape to something, it can be a knife used for whittling, a knife used for carving, a knife used for smoothing. It can be a knife used for sharpening pencils.For example, a pensil sharpener is a rautan.


if we wish to understand another society or culture or the things that they produce, the first thing we need to do is learn the language. It helps one hell of a lot.