Can Anyone Help ID this Keris ?

Boswego · 29th January 2005, 01:17 AM

Thanks for all the great knowledge and feedback.So from what I gather this is a Phillipine Moro Kris -poss a pre-19th Cent piece from the Marano Tribe/Province. What,generally,were these types of shortswords used for,and could I possibly locate a correct scabbard for it ?
(I'm a woodworker,and w/the correct native materials could fabricate one providing I had accurate ethnographic photos/measurements).

Andrew · 29th January 2005, 01:57 AM

Boswego, the Moro kris is a fighting weapon.

Could someone post up some scabbard pix for us to look at?

nechesh · 29th January 2005, 04:27 AM

Rick! How many times do i have to warn you not to post that gorgeous kris anymore!

drool, drool,drool, drool

Federico · 29th January 2005, 05:34 AM

Rick, Boswego's kris, and the middle kris in my pic are not true archaic style such as yours, hence the difference. They represent a mid-point between the Archaic, and the late 19th/early20th groups. Angle of the Gangya is 45 degrees, blades are larger, dapur more modern (hmm hard to describe wish I was able to post more pics), as you noted the arrowhead region is shallower. At least thats how I like to think about it. 3 identifiable ages of Moro kris, pre-1930. Archaic (such as yours), mid-point (Boswego's and the middle kris in my group), and 19th/early20th century (the vast majority of Kris we discuss here). Anyways, along with Nechesh, I must admit everytime you post that kris of yours I need a mop to clean up all the drool

BluErf. Exactly and kinda.

The story Ive always been told, was that older kris had larger deeper luks. As kris start to get larger, the luks shallow out and start becoming tighter in placement (Mindanao kris tending to have shallower luks that Sulu kris). Soooo...the idea that luk inflation played into this phenomena does sound very plausible. Another factor could be the introduction of greater amounts and higher quality steel in later periods (Spanish rails, US wagon springs, etc... in later periods vs. Chinese Iron pots, British wrought iron balls, etc... in earlier), perhaps made a less intensive and more maleable working material. What Ive always been told, while a kris with a high luk count may have more power, only those individuals with great personal power would be eligible to wield them, on the supernatural as well as practical level. Lotsa luks, supposedly harder to cut with (I dunno Ive always had fun manipulating my higher luk kris, but then again Ive never had to manipulate through actual intended mediums). Hmm...I have the feeling I went off on a tangent, and didnt actually make a good response. I apologize if Im coming from way out in left field.

MABAGANI · 29th January 2005, 06:06 AM

The blade looks Maranao but the hilt is typical Maguindanao, maybe from south Lake Lanao, between the two sultanates...nice form

Boswego · 29th January 2005, 07:27 AM

Frederico-So this Kris dates roughly between 1800 and the 1890's ? P.S.-Found some good maintenance/restoration tips on Your site.

Federico · 29th January 2005, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boswego

Frederico-So this Kris dates roughly between 1800 and the 1890's ? P.S.-Found some good maintenance/restoration tips on Your site.

Hello Boswego, well as I mentioned in the other thread, the dating, even the tribal assignment is very hot topic for debate. However, if we went by the theories in Bob Cato's book, I would say your kris would be roughly in the first half of the 19th century. Now of course, that is if the dating theory is correct. It could of course be much older, if the theories do indeed prove to be wrong. Anyways I am glad you found my site useful. Unfortunately I have not updated it for many years. Keep meaning too, but somehow other things keep popping up.

29th January 2005, 01:17 AM	#1
Boswego Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 23	Thanks for all the great knowledge and feedback.So from what I gather this is a Phillipine Moro Kris -poss a pre-19th Cent piece from the Marano Tribe/Province. What,generally,were these types of shortswords used for,and could I possibly locate a correct scabbard for it ? (I'm a woodworker,and w/the correct native materials could fabricate one providing I had accurate ethnographic photos/measurements).

29th January 2005, 01:57 AM	#2
Andrew Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: USA Posts: 1,725	Boswego, the Moro kris is a fighting weapon. Could someone post up some scabbard pix for us to look at?

29th January 2005, 04:27 AM	#3
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	Rick! How many times do i have to warn you not to post that gorgeous kris anymore! drool, drool,drool, drool

29th January 2005, 05:34 AM	#4
Federico Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Minneapolis, MN, USA Posts: 312	Rick, Boswego's kris, and the middle kris in my pic are not true archaic style such as yours, hence the difference. They represent a mid-point between the Archaic, and the late 19th/early20th groups. Angle of the Gangya is 45 degrees, blades are larger, dapur more modern (hmm hard to describe wish I was able to post more pics), as you noted the arrowhead region is shallower. At least thats how I like to think about it. 3 identifiable ages of Moro kris, pre-1930. Archaic (such as yours), mid-point (Boswego's and the middle kris in my group), and 19th/early20th century (the vast majority of Kris we discuss here). Anyways, along with Nechesh, I must admit everytime you post that kris of yours I need a mop to clean up all the drool BluErf. Exactly and kinda. The story Ive always been told, was that older kris had larger deeper luks. As kris start to get larger, the luks shallow out and start becoming tighter in placement (Mindanao kris tending to have shallower luks that Sulu kris). Soooo...the idea that luk inflation played into this phenomena does sound very plausible. Another factor could be the introduction of greater amounts and higher quality steel in later periods (Spanish rails, US wagon springs, etc... in later periods vs. Chinese Iron pots, British wrought iron balls, etc... in earlier), perhaps made a less intensive and more maleable working material. What Ive always been told, while a kris with a high luk count may have more power, only those individuals with great personal power would be eligible to wield them, on the supernatural as well as practical level. Lotsa luks, supposedly harder to cut with (I dunno Ive always had fun manipulating my higher luk kris, but then again Ive never had to manipulate through actual intended mediums). Hmm...I have the feeling I went off on a tangent, and didnt actually make a good response. I apologize if Im coming from way out in left field.

29th January 2005, 06:06 AM	#5
MABAGANI Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 221	The blade looks Maranao but the hilt is typical Maguindanao, maybe from south Lake Lanao, between the two sultanates...nice form

29th January 2005, 07:27 AM	#6
Boswego Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 23	Frederico-So this Kris dates roughly between 1800 and the 1890's ? P.S.-Found some good maintenance/restoration tips on Your site.