BARUNG TAUSUG?

David · 19th August 2020, 11:48 PM

So Xasterix, but i see two rather different blade profiles here. The differences are subtle, but clear to me.

Sajen · 20th August 2020, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

So Xasterix, but i see two rather different blade profiles here. The differences are subtle, but clear to me.

Hello David,

We really would need to see pictures from both (Yves and Xas) barungs in a similar angle like my example is shown.
It's rather difficult for me since they are not shown from up. I've played with pictures from both pieces but come to no conclusion.

Regards,
Detlef

Sajen · 20th August 2020, 01:14 AM

This is useuable! But need one from Yves to compare.

Ian · 20th August 2020, 01:44 AM

Perhaps Xas is referring to the wrap on the scabbard. This appears to be Yakan rather than Tausug. I had not looked carefully enough at the scabbard fittings. Part of the problem with very dark pictures is missing subtle but important features. Here's a better look at the scabbard and its wraps.

.

tanaruz · 20th August 2020, 02:28 AM

Hello friends,

Additional pics.

Note: the ferrule is silver.

Kind regards

Yves

Ian · 20th August 2020, 07:22 AM

Well, this is interesting. We have three similar barung, but perhaps not so similar. With roughly comparable pictures, we can put them side by side and see how they differ.

In the accompanying composite picture, top to bottom, we have Yves' original post, followed by an example posted from Yaz, and lastly a similar barung of Detlef. On each blade I have drawn a vertical white line halfway between the hilt and the tip. In addition, I have tried to define with a black arrow where each blade is at its widest point. It is apparent that the top (Yves) and bottom (Detlef) swords have a similar geometry: the widest point lies to the left (i.e., towards the hilt end) of the midpoint of the blade. The example of Yaz is different: the widest point of the blade lies to the right (i.e., towards the tip) of the blade. Yaz's blade also has a much straighter spine than the other two.

Yaz has identified his barung as Yakan, and I agree that Yakan blades (at least post WWII) have straighter spines and are weighted more towards the tip than are Sulu (Tausug, Samal) blades. The other two blades appear more consistent with Sulu blades, having their widest points closer to the hilt.

The hilts on the top and bottom examples also look Sulu, but I would need to have them in hand and inspect them more closely before excluding a Yakan origin. The Yakan coverings on the scabbards of Yves' and Yaz's examples has been noted already. Detlef's is less clear because there is no textile present and his scabbard is wrapped entirely in fine rattan.

So, accepting that Yaz has shown us a typical recent Yakan example, and the other two swords have different blades, then are the others perhaps Sulu blades in Yakan dress?

I do think that Yves and Detlef's swords look older than 1970, although the scabbards could be that vintage or later.

.

20th August 2020, 01:14 AM	#3
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,165	This is useuable! But need one from Yves to compare. Attached Images

20th August 2020, 01:44 AM	#4
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,362	Perhaps Xas is referring to the wrap on the scabbard. This appears to be Yakan rather than Tausug. I had not looked carefully enough at the scabbard fittings. Part of the problem with very dark pictures is missing subtle but important features. Here's a better look at the scabbard and its wraps. . Attached Images

20th August 2020, 02:28 AM	#5
tanaruz Member Join Date: Apr 2020 Posts: 273	BARUNG TAUSUG? Hello friends, Additional pics. Note: the ferrule is silver. Kind regards Yves Attached Images

20th August 2020, 07:22 AM	#6
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,362	Well, this is interesting. We have three similar barung, but perhaps not so similar. With roughly comparable pictures, we can put them side by side and see how they differ. In the accompanying composite picture, top to bottom, we have Yves' original post, followed by an example posted from Yaz, and lastly a similar barung of Detlef. On each blade I have drawn a vertical white line halfway between the hilt and the tip. In addition, I have tried to define with a black arrow where each blade is at its widest point. It is apparent that the top (Yves) and bottom (Detlef) swords have a similar geometry: the widest point lies to the left (i.e., towards the hilt end) of the midpoint of the blade. The example of Yaz is different: the widest point of the blade lies to the right (i.e., towards the tip) of the blade. Yaz's blade also has a much straighter spine than the other two. Yaz has identified his barung as Yakan, and I agree that Yakan blades (at least post WWII) have straighter spines and are weighted more towards the tip than are Sulu (Tausug, Samal) blades. The other two blades appear more consistent with Sulu blades, having their widest points closer to the hilt. The hilts on the top and bottom examples also look Sulu, but I would need to have them in hand and inspect them more closely before excluding a Yakan origin. The Yakan coverings on the scabbards of Yves' and Yaz's examples has been noted already. Detlef's is less clear because there is no textile present and his scabbard is wrapped entirely in fine rattan. So, accepting that Yaz has shown us a typical recent Yakan example, and the other two swords have different blades, then are the others perhaps Sulu blades in Yakan dress? I do think that Yves and Detlef's swords look older than 1970, although the scabbards could be that vintage or later. . Attached Images Last edited by Ian; 20th August 2020 at 07:34 AM.

19th August 2020, 11:48 PM	#1
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	So Xasterix, but i see two rather different blade profiles here. The differences are subtle, but clear to me.