Historical Khanjar

Jim McDougall · 2nd November 2018, 06:28 PM

Mahratt and Ariel, thank you both so much for these excellent explanations and descriptions on wootz and mechanical Damascus!

Ibrahiim, thank you as always for the historical and geographical character on this. There is so much dimension to these amazing daggers, which to the untrained eye probably all appear the same or similar.

Much appreciated having these elements well explained.

mahratt · 2nd November 2018, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

Mahratt and Ariel, thank you both so much for these excellent explanations and descriptions on wootz and mechanical Damascus!

Ibrahiim, thank you as always for the historical and geographical character on this. There is so much dimension to these amazing daggers, which to the untrained eye probably all appear the same or similar.

Much appreciated having these elements well explained.

Dear Jim

I think that You knew everything perfectly well without our comments

But thank you for the nice words.

Jim McDougall · 2nd November 2018, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mahratt

Dear Jim

I think that You knew everything perfectly well without our comments

But thank you for the nice words.

Nice of you to say, but for some reason scientific stuff just doesnt stick in my comprehension.....its a right brain, left brain thing "

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 3rd November 2018, 10:16 AM

As I was saying there have been a few wootz looking blades although now I note more appearing. I can only say that although I think these are better quality being sharper and better made with a finer edge that in the past it was not the usual tradition possibly because of price to go for this style...though I am certain they exist. The last picture shows the standard steel blade seen on most Omani Khanjars..I think the pictures speak for themselves which is just as well since metalurgical process is not my forte.

shayde78 · 10th November 2018, 03:59 AM

On the original blade, while I totally believe this to be mechanical Damascus, why is the pattern not visible within the cartouche? Is it merely the etch was polished away in this area, or could the pattern welds be that superficial?

Battara · 10th November 2018, 04:28 AM

shayde78, this is a good question. In order to place the thin ribbons of gold on the metal, the surface of the metal has to be grooved and "scratched" in order to hold the gold. Then the gold is hammered into the grooves. This is the essence of koftgari which you see on the blade. These grooves obscure the surface of the damascus, but the damascus is through out the length and depth of the blade.

RobertGuy · 10th November 2018, 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

shayde78, this is a good question. In order to place the thin ribbons of gold on the metal, the surface of the metal has to be grooved and "scratched" in order to hold the gold. Then the gold is hammered into the grooves. This is the essence of koftgari which you see on the blade. These grooves obscure the surface of the damascus, but the damascus is through out the length and depth of the blade.

I would also point out that there appears to be a photographic watermark positioned on the cartouche. This could also obscure the pattern welds in this area.

3rd November 2018, 10:16 AM	#4
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	As I was saying there have been a few wootz looking blades although now I note more appearing. I can only say that although I think these are better quality being sharper and better made with a finer edge that in the past it was not the usual tradition possibly because of price to go for this style...though I am certain they exist. The last picture shows the standard steel blade seen on most Omani Khanjars..I think the pictures speak for themselves which is just as well since metalurgical process is not my forte. Attached Images

2nd November 2018, 06:28 PM	#1
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,194	Mahratt and Ariel, thank you both so much for these excellent explanations and descriptions on wootz and mechanical Damascus! Ibrahiim, thank you as always for the historical and geographical character on this. There is so much dimension to these amazing daggers, which to the untrained eye probably all appear the same or similar. Much appreciated having these elements well explained.

10th November 2018, 03:59 AM	#5
shayde78 Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 445	On the original blade, while I totally believe this to be mechanical Damascus, why is the pattern not visible within the cartouche? Is it merely the etch was polished away in this area, or could the pattern welds be that superficial?

10th November 2018, 04:28 AM	#6
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,272	shayde78, this is a good question. In order to place the thin ribbons of gold on the metal, the surface of the metal has to be grooved and "scratched" in order to hold the gold. Then the gold is hammered into the grooves. This is the essence of koftgari which you see on the blade. These grooves obscure the surface of the damascus, but the damascus is through out the length and depth of the blade.