Bronze Luristan Axe

shayde78 · 19th October 2018, 05:06 AM

Next, we have an axe from the Metropolitan Museum of Art and two axes from the Museum of Fine Arts.

shayde78 · 19th October 2018, 05:13 AM

Finally, I am including two pictures of examples of ancient bronzes from the Royal Ontario Museum. These are listed as 'Cycladic', and date to about 2000BCE (or about 1000 years earlier than the time to which Luristan artifacts are dated). I include them for further comparison of bronze patination and excavated condition. As artifacts from Cycladic culture do not have the same reputation for forgeries, we may (perhaps!) trust the museum's attribution to both culture and date.

kronckew · 20th October 2018, 12:11 AM

Mine was disucussed and has a bit more info HERE

shayde78 · 22nd October 2018, 10:54 PM

Thank you, Konckew! I saw your thread when I was researching these. I was hoping you'd weigh in, because I wanted to ask if you based your handle reconstruction on any known renditions of these. I have had a devil of a time finding carvings of axes in use that show the hafts. I like how yours turned out, and was considering something similar (if I can determine mine to be a reproduction with any certainty).

kronckew · 23rd October 2018, 09:05 AM

I post this mostly as a warning. Do not buy these from ebay thinking they are originals. You might get a real one from a reputable dealer, but check the provenances before shelling out a few hundred bills.

I almost bought an ash dowel. I had a carved walking stick I bought for a few pounds via ebay that was narrower than I'd hoped. I stuck it in the socket more to check how the dowel might look. it stopped where you see it and the grip looked right somehow, so I cut the excess wood off, bedded it in resin and it is comfortable and feels like they belong together. the carved swell fits my hand perfectly & as it was a vintage used cane, the grip area was patinated a bit darker and smoother than the rest by it's past and looks like it was made for the head and well used...

I couldn't find any examples of how the originals were hafted, but this was serendipitous. It is of course, a parade/display item, these fancy ones probably were even with the originals from the early iron age. I still wouldn't want to get hit with it. I have seen a reproduction shiny brand new looking one from a company in Australia that had what looked like a dowel handle with a slow twist spiral groove carved in it. Fairly sure it was not 'historic'. Bit over my budget for the whole thing too. see below. Most of my true antique ethnic axes have a bit of a swell at the hand end, or a ball to keep your hand from sliding off.

As purchased (on ebay & very cheaply too) the head had a few shiny golden areas in places where it shouldn't & couldn't have been from wear. After seeing a few just like it for sale cheaply I feel safe it is a fake. I've seen the same ones sold there for silly money.

The bronze head was then cleaned with salt and vinegar to get rid of the thin layer of yucky green cow dung verdigris, then properly 'aged' to the dark brown it is now.

As in all things, CAVEAT EMPTOR! If the deal looks too good to be true, it probably isn't.

shayde78 · 26th October 2018, 10:18 PM

Very much agree, Kronckew. I avoid these on ebay. This was from an estate sale that included high end items. Even so, I wouldn't have paid a dear price because of the volume of reproductions. I limited myself to a price that would be appropriate for a reproduction, but of course, I still held hope that it might prove to be authentic.

I guess short of consulting with a museum, there is no other way of finding out. I'm not far from the Met in NYC, or the Univ. of Penn (which has a great department of near eastern studies). How does one even go about asking for a consult from such large institutions?

kronckew · 26th October 2018, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shayde78

... How does one even go about asking for a consult from such large institutions?

I'd just walk in the front door, walk up to the nearest staff member and ask for the middle eastern antiquities section offices.

You might be able to phone them and find someone.

The Met:

email: communications@metmuseum.org

Or write them at

1000 Fifth Avenue
New York, NY 10028
Phone: 212-535-7710

19th October 2018, 05:06 AM	#1
shayde78 Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 445	Next, we have an axe from the Metropolitan Museum of Art and two axes from the Museum of Fine Arts. Attached Images

19th October 2018, 05:13 AM	#2
shayde78 Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 445	Finally, I am including two pictures of examples of ancient bronzes from the Royal Ontario Museum. These are listed as 'Cycladic', and date to about 2000BCE (or about 1000 years earlier than the time to which Luristan artifacts are dated). I include them for further comparison of bronze patination and excavated condition. As artifacts from Cycladic culture do not have the same reputation for forgeries, we may (perhaps!) trust the museum's attribution to both culture and date. Attached Images

20th October 2018, 12:11 AM	#3
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,215	Mine was disucussed and has a bit more info HERE Attached Images

23rd October 2018, 09:05 AM	#5
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,215	I post this mostly as a warning. Do not buy these from ebay thinking they are originals. You might get a real one from a reputable dealer, but check the provenances before shelling out a few hundred bills. I almost bought an ash dowel. I had a carved walking stick I bought for a few pounds via ebay that was narrower than I'd hoped. I stuck it in the socket more to check how the dowel might look. it stopped where you see it and the grip looked right somehow, so I cut the excess wood off, bedded it in resin and it is comfortable and feels like they belong together. the carved swell fits my hand perfectly & as it was a vintage used cane, the grip area was patinated a bit darker and smoother than the rest by it's past and looks like it was made for the head and well used... I couldn't find any examples of how the originals were hafted, but this was serendipitous. It is of course, a parade/display item, these fancy ones probably were even with the originals from the early iron age. I still wouldn't want to get hit with it. I have seen a reproduction shiny brand new looking one from a company in Australia that had what looked like a dowel handle with a slow twist spiral groove carved in it. Fairly sure it was not 'historic'. Bit over my budget for the whole thing too. see below. Most of my true antique ethnic axes have a bit of a swell at the hand end, or a ball to keep your hand from sliding off. As purchased (on ebay & very cheaply too) the head had a few shiny golden areas in places where it shouldn't & couldn't have been from wear. After seeing a few just like it for sale cheaply I feel safe it is a fake. I've seen the same ones sold there for silly money. The bronze head was then cleaned with salt and vinegar to get rid of the thin layer of yucky green cow dung verdigris, then properly 'aged' to the dark brown it is now. As in all things, CAVEAT EMPTOR! If the deal looks too good to be true, it probably isn't. Attached Images Last edited by kronckew; 23rd October 2018 at 09:30 AM.

22nd October 2018, 10:54 PM	#4
shayde78 Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 445	Thank you, Konckew! I saw your thread when I was researching these. I was hoping you'd weigh in, because I wanted to ask if you based your handle reconstruction on any known renditions of these. I have had a devil of a time finding carvings of axes in use that show the hafts. I like how yours turned out, and was considering something similar (if I can determine mine to be a reproduction with any certainty).

26th October 2018, 10:18 PM	#6
shayde78 Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 445	Very much agree, Kronckew. I avoid these on ebay. This was from an estate sale that included high end items. Even so, I wouldn't have paid a dear price because of the volume of reproductions. I limited myself to a price that would be appropriate for a reproduction, but of course, I still held hope that it might prove to be authentic. I guess short of consulting with a museum, there is no other way of finding out. I'm not far from the Met in NYC, or the Univ. of Penn (which has a great department of near eastern studies). How does one even go about asking for a consult from such large institutions?