How many researchers are there on the forum when it comes to Indian wapons

Ian · 20th September 2018, 10:17 PM

Jens:

Thank you for raising an important question. I think there is a dearth of younger researchers in just about every area of ethnographic arms collecting. Encouraging young people to engage in our fields of interest is an ongoing challenge. Time and money seem to be the big barriers to engaging in ethnographic collecting and research, although the internet has certainly enabled us to access images of many more items than previously. Most people I know who are interested in ethnographic arms research came to it through their collecting (hence the cost of getting interested). My job, which involved travel internationally, greatly helped my research interests and provided me time to do that research. Not everyone has that good fortune, especially at a young age.

Jens, there are several contributors to this forum who are considerably younger than we are, and may one day develop the research skills that you have. I know a couple of guys who lived near me in Minneapolis, and linking up in person is so much better for communication than simply chatting online. Chatting online, however, is infinitely better than never meeting at all.

Ian.

Edster · 21st September 2018, 02:48 PM

Jens,

I agree with Ian, but in addition to time and desire, one needs to know HOW to research. Major slick paged and photo rich A&A books are well known but often superficial in content. Usually a key to learning more is to access these author's references and footnotes, and then the references of these references. For example, my prime interest is Sudan's kaskara. I knew that Sudan Notes and Records was a colonial journal from 1918 to 1974 with lots of anthropological materials on the various ethnic groups inhabit this vast area. I developed access to all articles SNR had produced and began to graze through then. By chance I found in an article on customs of the Northern Bega a one page description of sword type names linked to their fuller construction. That became the basis to my Fuller essay on this forum.

In addition to swords I found out about who could forge iron, other weapons like long and short spears, throwing knives and sticks, and the use of poison arrows.

One way to get immersed in the subject is to Google on Indian Colonial Journals. This came up at random.
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/...nalCode=fich20

Search on Libgen to see if journals have been archived. Google Books and Project Gutenberg are great resources for old travel narratives.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Library_Genesis

How to access Libgen:
http://emilkirkegaard.dk/en/?p=7172

As in Internet Archive:
https://archive.org/

For example while its more oriented to European arms, here is a link to Gladius journal
http://gladius.revistas.csic.es/inde.../issue/archive

A most of this digging is low yield, but it builds and in total you find quality information not obviously available. Think of it as detective work or being an intelligence analyst. Solve the mystery. I think internet research is more entertaining than watching current evening TV.

Happy hunting,
Ed

Jens Nordlunde · 21st September 2018, 03:55 PM

Ian and Ed,

What you write is true, as it does take a lot of time, and a lot of stones to turn.

Ian has been lucky to have a work which made him research at the same time - on the spot so to say. Unfortunately I did not have this option, so I had to do my studies from books. This is all right, but you need to have a lot of books, and not all authors write the same about the same episode, so you have to check it once more, to find the description which you believe most in.
Like in my article Saadat Khan Bahadur the First Nawab of Oudh. In one book it says that he took poison, by in another book, written by someone who knew him, it says that he had cancer, and from that he died.

Ed, you hit the nail right on the head. HOW do you start? Reference books and notes in books and articles are very good starters. Time to wait for an opening - which can take a very long time, if you are not lucky.
The first tulwar I bought in 1967, and only recently I saw a picture of a hilt which must have been made at the same place, maybe of the same man who made my hilt. Ok it does not have to take such a long time. A Pesh Kabz I have with a very special decoration, recently I saw a picture of a sword hilt with the same decoration. only a picture without any comments. The Pesh Kabz I bought is 1973.
This may sound frightening, but it is really not, as research can be done in many ways, depending on how deep you want to dig.

Jens

shayde78 · 22nd September 2018, 01:44 AM

Thank you for issuing a bit of a challenge for folks to hone their skills as researchers. While I am certain this community fully values the expertise on display here, I'm not so sure everyone fully appreciates the labor expended to gain this knowledge.

I know, personally, the demands of career and family make both my time and finances short of fully indulging my interests. That said, I endeavor to build my knowledge through steady efforts, and appreciate being pointed in the right direction to access information.

Thanks again!

Jens Nordlunde · 22nd September 2018, 04:56 PM

Shayde78,
Thank you for your post.
Depending on where you live, libraries and museums can often be of a big help, but you can also ask here on the forum, which books to buy or lend. Many of the books have been reprinted, so the price is low.
If you want to research, you must be aware of, that books are books, and the written word is the written word - but not always as sharp as a sword:-). So you should compare texts about the same subject to make sure you get the correct version.
Jens

21st September 2018, 02:48 PM	#2
Edster Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 411	Jens, I agree with Ian, but in addition to time and desire, one needs to know HOW to research. Major slick paged and photo rich A&A books are well known but often superficial in content. Usually a key to learning more is to access these author's references and footnotes, and then the references of these references. For example, my prime interest is Sudan's kaskara. I knew that Sudan Notes and Records was a colonial journal from 1918 to 1974 with lots of anthropological materials on the various ethnic groups inhabit this vast area. I developed access to all articles SNR had produced and began to graze through then. By chance I found in an article on customs of the Northern Bega a one page description of sword type names linked to their fuller construction. That became the basis to my Fuller essay on this forum. In addition to swords I found out about who could forge iron, other weapons like long and short spears, throwing knives and sticks, and the use of poison arrows. One way to get immersed in the subject is to Google on Indian Colonial Journals. This came up at random. https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/...nalCode=fich20 Search on Libgen to see if journals have been archived. Google Books and Project Gutenberg are great resources for old travel narratives. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Library_Genesis How to access Libgen: http://emilkirkegaard.dk/en/?p=7172 As in Internet Archive: https://archive.org/ For example while its more oriented to European arms, here is a link to Gladius journal http://gladius.revistas.csic.es/inde.../issue/archive A most of this digging is low yield, but it builds and in total you find quality information not obviously available. Think of it as detective work or being an intelligence analyst. Solve the mystery. I think internet research is more entertaining than watching current evening TV. Happy hunting, Ed Last edited by Edster; 22nd September 2018 at 01:11 PM.

20th September 2018, 10:17 PM	#1
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,363	Jens: Thank you for raising an important question. I think there is a dearth of younger researchers in just about every area of ethnographic arms collecting. Encouraging young people to engage in our fields of interest is an ongoing challenge. Time and money seem to be the big barriers to engaging in ethnographic collecting and research, although the internet has certainly enabled us to access images of many more items than previously. Most people I know who are interested in ethnographic arms research came to it through their collecting (hence the cost of getting interested). My job, which involved travel internationally, greatly helped my research interests and provided me time to do that research. Not everyone has that good fortune, especially at a young age. Jens, there are several contributors to this forum who are considerably younger than we are, and may one day develop the research skills that you have. I know a couple of guys who lived near me in Minneapolis, and linking up in person is so much better for communication than simply chatting online. Chatting online, however, is infinitely better than never meeting at all. Ian.

21st September 2018, 03:55 PM	#3
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Ian and Ed, What you write is true, as it does take a lot of time, and a lot of stones to turn. Ian has been lucky to have a work which made him research at the same time - on the spot so to say. Unfortunately I did not have this option, so I had to do my studies from books. This is all right, but you need to have a lot of books, and not all authors write the same about the same episode, so you have to check it once more, to find the description which you believe most in. Like in my article Saadat Khan Bahadur the First Nawab of Oudh. In one book it says that he took poison, by in another book, written by someone who knew him, it says that he had cancer, and from that he died. Ed, you hit the nail right on the head. HOW do you start? Reference books and notes in books and articles are very good starters. Time to wait for an opening - which can take a very long time, if you are not lucky. The first tulwar I bought in 1967, and only recently I saw a picture of a hilt which must have been made at the same place, maybe of the same man who made my hilt. Ok it does not have to take such a long time. A Pesh Kabz I have with a very special decoration, recently I saw a picture of a sword hilt with the same decoration. only a picture without any comments. The Pesh Kabz I bought is 1973. This may sound frightening, but it is really not, as research can be done in many ways, depending on how deep you want to dig. Jens

22nd September 2018, 01:44 AM	#4
shayde78 Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 445	Thank you for issuing a bit of a challenge for folks to hone their skills as researchers. While I am certain this community fully values the expertise on display here, I'm not so sure everyone fully appreciates the labor expended to gain this knowledge. I know, personally, the demands of career and family make both my time and finances short of fully indulging my interests. That said, I endeavor to build my knowledge through steady efforts, and appreciate being pointed in the right direction to access information. Thanks again!

22nd September 2018, 04:56 PM	#5
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Shayde78, Thank you for your post. Depending on where you live, libraries and museums can often be of a big help, but you can also ask here on the forum, which books to buy or lend. Many of the books have been reprinted, so the price is low. If you want to research, you must be aware of, that books are books, and the written word is the written word - but not always as sharp as a sword:-). So you should compare texts about the same subject to make sure you get the correct version. Jens