Piha Kaetta off the bucket list

[Kubur]

Originally Posted by Sajen

Hello all,

I know next to nothing about Phia Kaettas exempt I like this very nice knives very much. But let me ask a question, I've read now in this thread several times the word "weapon" in relation to them. To my eye this knives don't look like real weapons, I think that they from the shape look more like some sort of working knife, cutting betel for example. Is there in any way a clear agreement for what they get used? Excuse my maybe stupid question!
PS: the knife which started the thread is very very nice!

Regards,
Detlef

Hi,
You are right, they are not weapons.
But it's also true that you can stab someone with a kitchen knife...unfortunately...
Also half of the rifles on this forum were used for hunting.
Please note that in an old post I mentionned that most probably near half of the weapons on this forum were never used to fight...
Best,
Kubur

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Although we already know that this knife was a presentation as well as social status Icon and probably not intended in this regard as a battlefield weapon...the fact is that we have no evidence of it being used in a fight but as already stated that doesn't make it a feather duster either!

An interesting side issue to the pihā-kaetta is the peculiar spike or stylus which is supposed to be for writing on palm leaves, however, "it is said that" the spike as a weapon is extremely dangerous and seen sheathed in the same scabbard as the pihā-kaetta ..

I gleaned from Sri Lankan friends here that the spike is called keynithuh and is very dangerous since it was often poisoned. It is also suggested that special forces carry this concealed weapon ...

I have also seen huge pihā-kaetta which may be viewed on video simply by typing in Piha Kaetta to web search and selecting the correct video.

In my view therefor it may well have been an Icon worn with honour as a badge of office etc and also used in the palm leaf writing situation but if required it may also have been used as a knife...for cutting string, killing chickens or as a weapon in a fight...

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Please view~

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=765

~where at #10 there is an excellent description of the different dagger stytles...which I have pleasure in recording again here ...by Derek in 2005.viz;

Quote" Daggers possess a variety of names depending upon the material forming the hilt and the shape of the blade. Those with handles of rocks such as crystal (J.F. Pieris 1938) or green marble are "Gal Mita Pihiya", the delicate narrow blades are "Ul Pihiya", the curved ones are the "Vak Pihiya" , and the chopper form is the "Pihiya Kattha" The hilt is either straight with the pommel twisted downward towards the edge, or downward and then upward towards the reverse of the blade."Unquote.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Some Museum items ~ The Piha Keatta and Stylus from Met Museum at ~

https://www.metmuseum.org/art/collection/search/32248

The Met. gets right down to it and calls this spike a skewer! It is clearly designed to go with the dagger since it has a special hole slotted into the front of the scabbard. It is suggested that originally this form may have been for the fine art of writing on Palm Leaves so that what the dagger may have been for originally was for the purpose of cutting leaves.

The bird head original style hilt gave way to an amorphous blob highly decorated and beautifully carved in abstract form. Some scabbards show what is probably original form carved parrot heads at the end...similar to Kastane scabbards.

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by Kubur

Hi,
You are right, they are not weapons.
But it's also true that you can stab someone with a kitchen knife...unfortunately...
Also half of the rifles on this forum were used for hunting.
Please note that in an old post I mentionned that most probably near half of the weapons on this forum were never used to fight...
Best,
Kubur

Thank you Kubur,

but I really doubt that they would make a "good" fighting knife. What I have observed is that the ones without ricasso at the edge seems to be heavy used in the middle and the ones with are worn in the first third of the edge like it get something cut at the same place and same manner when you understand what I mean. I think Betel would be a good guess. This was also part in my previous request, is there known any solid based knowledge for what they get used regularly? And I have another statement about we should think about, there are so many fancy ones that I think it was worn by celebration and show the status also!?

Best regards,
Detlef

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by Sajen

Thank you Kubur,

but I really doubt that they would make a "good" fighting knife. What I have observed is that the ones without ricasso at the edge seems to be heavy used in the middle and the ones with are worn in the first third of the edge like it get something cut at the same place and same manner when you understand what I mean. I think Betel would be a good guess. This was also part in my previous request, is there known any solid based knowledge for what they get used regularly? And I have another statement about we should think about, there are so many fancy ones that I think it was worn by celebration and show the status also!?

Best regards,
Detlef

Please see #18 above where I outline with a quotation from a famous Museum ~ http://collections.vam.ac.uk/item/O...g-tool-unknown/ ~ Quote" [B]

The pihiya or piha kaetta was a hand knife of often delicate workmanship from Southern India and Sri Lanka. It was commonly carried in an ornate scabbard as a personal accessory and sometimes also included a stylus for writing on palm leaf. The degree of decoration often signified the rank or status of the individual and ornate knives were presented to individuals as tokens of esteem."Unquote.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

To broaden the style so far observed and to remind readers of detail already at Forum Library on this weapon...I place again here the Library detail. Viz;

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=765

Different Designs. I find it interesting that so many styles and sizes existed and in the case below so closely related to the Castane/Kastane as to suggest it was in this case virtually a Castane/Kastane Dagger...

Caveat to the below illustration ... The more I look at this the more I suggest that this is not a Piha Kaetta and that it has been rehilted with a Kastane hilt and with a replacement scabbard...and with a stylus with a wooden handle added. The blade may be a reworked Piha Keatta but the overall design looks concocted.

See https://3kberlin.de/2015/ein-piha-kaetta/ for details...

[Rick]

Originally Posted by Kubur

Hi,
You are right, they are not weapons.
But it's also true that you can stab someone with a kitchen knife...unfortunately...
Also half of the rifles on this forum were used for hunting.
Please note that in an old post I mentionned that most probably near half of the weapons on this forum were never used to fight...
Best,
Kubur

[Jim McDougall]

Excellent Rick, and a perfect illustration of the nebulous boundaries between weapon and tool. As noted previously, the piha kaetta was used extensively in cutting stylus' for writing on leaves, the writing medium in lieu of paper, papyrus or other material. While these were typically court or well to do figures' knives and intended as suitably embellished accoutrements, much as court swords and the like, and they could certainly be used as weapons and with effect.

They seem to have been utility oriented as some are with accompanying kit items.

As well shown here, even a simple cutlery or kitchen item can become a weapon of opportunity, and present deadly results. On the frontiers, a knife was not only for dressing game and utility, but for self defense (or attack as the case might be). While the espada ancha, the hanger type sword worn by horsemen in northern Mexico and American Southwest are considered to be weapons, they were used more as machetes in chopping through heavy desert vegetation and chapparal. I really cannot think of any instance in period narratives which express their use in combat.

[Kubur]

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

As well shown here, even a simple cutlery or kitchen item can become a weapon of opportunity, and present deadly results. On the frontiers, a knife was not only for dressing game and utility, but for self defense (or attack as the case might be). While the espada ancha, the hanger type sword worn by horsemen in northern Mexico and American Southwest are considered to be weapons, they were used more as machetes in chopping through heavy desert vegetation and chapparal. I really cannot think of any instance in period narratives which express their use in combat.

Yes and what about the kukri? Is it a machete or a weapon? Both I guess

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Kubur

Yes and what about the kukri? Is it a machete or a weapon? Both I guess

Indeed it is both, much as many if not most edged weapons in SE Asia as well. Most of the dha's and various forms are used by tribes interchangeably as both tools and weapons as I have understood. I am sure those well versed on the weapons of these areas may better elaborate, but in old National Geographic magazines there are often wonderful photos of tribal figures in these regions chopping wood etc with various weapons.
There are of course many examples and anecdotes regarding this, far too many to deviate from our focus on the piha kaetta.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Now to focus in on the Piha Keatta namely in the bird head use on the original style hilt and on the peculiar parrots head at the end of the scabbard. Birdshead decorated hilts seem to have fluttered in from South India and also have graced many fine daggers in Mughal times. In fact, the reality is that over many centuries Indian craftsmen have been openly invited to the Sri Lankan Royal Workshops. It is hardly surprising that inter related designs have permeated Sri Lankan form... naturally and in ways linked to Buddhist and Hindu styles...as well as the obvious regional influences.

Below are a few examples of Indian Bird hilts and the effect onto Sri Lankan weapons...in this case I focus on the Parrot-like Piha Kaetta scabbard tips.~

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

It is said that the name of the stylus is
'ULKATUVA' used to train a student to write on a palm leaf. Once he is trained he is permitted to use a different type of stylus the 'PANHINDA'
I had previously placed the stylus name as Keynithuth but will recheck that source...

The materials decide what the name of the style of dagger is called ...In the case of Crystal; Gal Mita Pihiya and below a Met museum example..