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Salaams Colin Henshaw, You have introduced a great subject... I Quote https://anthromuseum.missouri.edu/gr...carchery.shtml "From medieval times through the nineteenth century, archers of the Islamic crescent, stretching from Turkey eastward to India, were renowned for both their exceptional skills and superior weapons. As a necessary means of advancing the spread of Islam, weapons traditionally held a religious association in Muslim cultures. The bow and arrow, which are extolled in many sayings of the Prophet Muhammad, held a special place above all others. Training in archery was seen as a religious duty and a sign of status, and the craftmanship of archery equipment was highly esteemed. The legacy of Islamic archery is exemplified by the archery traditions and equipment of Ottoman Turkey (1453–1922), of Iran during the Safavid–Qajar periods (1502–1925), and of the Indian subcontinent throughout the Mughal era (1526–1857), which blended Islamic and Hindu cultural elements"Unquote. Regards, Ibrahiim al Balooshi. Below Jarmakee ...The peculiar position for firing at targets directly below...from a fort wall. The archer in blue on a black horse is Ottoman firing directly behind him. See https://www.google.com/search?q=turk...M361TX6vGa6hM: The bigger picture shows a mounted Mongolian Archer... The Indo Persian bow picture and write up can be seen at https://www.pinterest.com/pin/363243526177126131/ Last edited by Ibrahiim al Balooshi; 5th July 2017 at 02:32 PM. |
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#2 |
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[QUOTE=Ibrahiim al Balooshi]"From medieval times through the nineteenth century, archers of the Islamic crescent, stretching from Turkey eastward to India, were renowned for both their exceptional skills and superior weapons. As a necessary means of advancing the spread of Islam, weapons traditionally held a religious association in Muslim cultures. The bow and arrow, which are extolled in many sayings of the Prophet Muhammad, held a special place above all others. Training in archery was seen as a religious duty and a sign of status, and the craftmanship of archery equipment was highly esteemed. The legacy of Islamic archery is exemplified by the archery traditions and equipment of Ottoman Turkey (1453–1922), of Iran during the Safavid–Qajar periods (1502–1925), and of the Indian subcontinent throughout the Mughal era (1526–1857), which blended Islamic and Hindu cultural elements"
Just for precison, Ibrahim, though I don't disagree with the cultural and religious importance of archery in the Muslim culture, the role of archery, its cultural importance and even the type of bow from the Persians, Ottomans, Mughal and Mamluke dynasties in India, does not derive from their religion, but from their Central Asian cultural and military heritage. It was there before the islamization of the Persians and Turks and is the same of that of the Mongols, and before them the Partians and Scythians, Hsiung-nu and many others. Remember that the Ottomans and Seljuks were only part of an inmense confederation of the Oghuz Turks, who roamed in the Eurasian steppe and just latter some of them converted to Islam. The same apply to the Mongols and Turks integrated in a Central Asian Empire which is the origin of the Mughals of India. Maybe Islam reinforced this cultural current, or maybe it was the other way around, that this pre-existing culture of archery among those peoples reinforced that of the already had by the Islamic conquerors who spread their religion to Persia and part of Central Asia. Regards |
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[QUOTE=Gonzalo G]
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Salaams Gonzalo G, Firstly many thanks for posting on this great subject which for too long has gone un-examined by Forum. I had a reasonable go at introducing the subject at the European and it is nice to see this thread gathering pace on Ethnographic. By chance it seems that the Turkish Foot Bow and the Welsh Long never came into deadly combat with each other. The extraordinary greater range of the Turkish Bow would certainly have sent the opposition back to the drawing board I suspect. Regarding the religious context I think it has been viewed out of context... It was a quote from https://anthromuseum.missouri.edu/g...icarchery.shtml which I consider not inaccurate neither does it say the bow was derived from religion ...in fact it goes on to say ~ Quote" The legacy of Islamic archery is exemplified by the archery traditions and equipment of Ottoman Turkey (1453–1922), of Iran during the Safavid–Qajar periods (1502–1925), and of the Indian subcontinent throughout the Mughal era (1526–1857), which blended Islamic and Hindu cultural elements"Unquote. What perhaps it did not underline was where the earlier concept derived from, however, I think it was inferred that people understood the origin..for which the Mongolian Archer is clearly the pointer. I think emphasis on Blended. Certainly as I read it there was no inference on ownership of style belonging to the religion...but that surely they observed a formidable weapon and adapted and adopted the system and built a military structure around its training in the case of the Turks with their Janissaries and the Mamluke with their recruits taken often as young as 6 years old from the Steppes. Moreover the subject is a fascinating one and I hope more members can get involved ... Pinterest is bombarding my mail with all things archery and I am certain good photographic evidence will add to the thread in due course. Regards, Ibrahiim al Balooshi. |
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#4 | |
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Regards P.D. Thank you for the string to the Arab archery book, but I introduced it to my web search window...and noting happened, I mean, it did not open a page with the book. Maybe I did something wrong, please advise me. |
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![]() ![]() Last edited by Ibrahiim al Balooshi; 7th July 2017 at 11:52 PM. |
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Regards |
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#9 | |
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AFAIK, the Mongol adoption of the Manchu bow was driven by the Manchu conquest of Mongolia. After the Mongolian Mongols adopted it, then it spread to Moghulistan, and next to Mawarannahr/Transoxiana (under Uzbek rule by then), and then to the Crimean Khanate. By the time the Manchu bow reaches Crimea, it's shrunk a bit (but is still a big bow) - smaller ears, smaller string bridge, and also less reflexed. The Crimean Khanate being an Ottoman protectorate, the Ottomans are exposed to this bow. At which point, bows appear in the Ottoman Empire which are intermediate in size between the traditional Ottoman bow and the Crimean/Manchu bow. The new bows are about 50"/125cm long, as compared with the traditional 40"/100cm bows, and the 60"/160cm Crimean/Manchu bow (and the 66"-72"/170-180cm Manchu/Qing bow). |
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Thank you for your reply, Timo. The Ottoman bows I have seen does not have the siyah-ears big and so rigid (so it seems) like the Manchu. But I have only seen some Ottoman and Manchu bows in pictures, never seen one personally, and they look different. The Manchu bow seem more "Hunnish", but symmetrical. I have only elemental knowledge of the historic composite bow from the Orient, that's why I asked for the specific influences, like beign more robust, bigger than the originals, siyah bigger or more rigid, different profiles-curvatures-proportions, etc.
I also wonder if those Timurid warriors should carry their swords edge up. Regards Last edited by Gonzalo G; 8th July 2017 at 09:31 AM. |
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#11 | |
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Thanks for your input. Yes, I think I will make a study of Asian & Islamic archery, it seems interesting. Was the bow and arrow ever used in Arabia ? Regards |
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#12 | |
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Downloadable PDF http://www.freepdf.info/index.php?post/Arab-Archery Authors : Faris Nabih Amin - Elmer Robert Potter Title : Arab Archery An Arabic manuscript of about A.D. 1500 “Book on the Excellence of the Bow and Arrow” and the Description thereof. Introduction. This unique manuscript, discovered in the Garrett Collection of Arabic Manuscripts at Princeton University Library, is the only known treatise available in English on the archery of the medieval Orient. It is considered by Dr. Faris and Dr. Elmer as equal in merit to the nearly contemporary Toxophilus, or the Schole of Shootynge, the chief source of detailed knowledge of early English archery. The manuscript could be used today as a textbook on archery, and is valuable to all students of Arab history and culture and to philologists in a number of fields. One of its most unusual contributions is its resurrection of an ancient system of finger-reckoning—the ancient Arabic system of conveying numerical values by a highly developed sign language involving the use of only a single hand. Though scholars have suspected that such a medium once existed, its details were completely lost. By its delicate and accurately formed manual postures it is sharply differentiated from the crude gestures which indicate "the nine digits" and some of their more simple combinations by holding up an equal number of fingers. Each of these rediscovered combinations, used to represent draws of the bow, is illustrated by a sketch. Another interesting contribution is the solution of the "double nock" problem which has hitherto been one of the most controversial puzzles in archery. I am not sure how accurate this image is but it appears to be an Arabian archer. THE VINKHUIJZEN COLLECTION OF MILITARY UNIFORMS Spain, 1213-1488, Moros Alfaraces... ([Año] 1410). Last edited by estcrh; 6th July 2017 at 11:44 PM. |
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#13 |
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Treaty of the military art Mamelouk, containing the schools of platoon, rider, infantryman, archer and crossbowman. A large number of colored and rather well-drawn figures are inserted in the text. Like all Arab works on the same subject, this treatise contains a large number of technical terms and terms of command.
Beginning: الحمد لله ذى العظمة المتعالى بالقدرة عن الصفات و الامثال. This ms. Was executed in 875 of the Hegira (1470 AD), for a great personage of the court of the Sultans Mameluk, whose name was carefully removed from the frontispiece, which is very ornate. However, the last words contained in the central medallion, namely: عزه الله تعالى, which indicates that the last name was that of a sultan. Gold, The ruler of Egypt at that time was Qaitbai. Between the folios currently rated 1 and 2, several sheets are missing. |
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APPARENTLY THERE IS A FREE DOWNLOAD...CHECKING.. WRITE UP STATES~ The Mamluks were, at one distinct point in history, the greatest body of fighting men in the world and the quintessence of the mounted warrior. They were slave soldiers, imported as boys into the Islamic Empire from the pagan Steppes, but they became its savior, bringing defeat to the Mongols and forming the machine of jihad that ultimately destroyed the Crusader Kingdoms of Palestine and Syria. They entered the Islamic world as unlettered automatons and through a total application to the craft of the warrior they became more than soldiers. After a bloody seizure of power from their masters, the descendants of Saladin, they developed a martial code and an honor system based on barracks brotherhood, a sophisticated military society that harnessed the state's energies for total war and produced a series of treatises on warfare that more than compare to SunZi's Art of War in their complexity, beauty of language and comprehensive coverage of the bloody business of war. Their story embraces many of the great themes of medieval military endeavor. The Crusaders and the deadly contest between Islam and Christendom, the Mongols and their vision of World Dominion, Tamerlane the Scourge of God and the rise of the Ottoman Empire whose new slave soldiers, the Janissaries, would be the Mamluks' final nemesis. Another review says~ In lieu of an abstract, here is a brief excerpt of the content:Quote" Reviewed by John Dunn The Knights of Islam: The Wars of the Mamluks. By James Waterson. St.Paul, Minn.: MBI Publishing, 2007. ISBN 978-1-85367-734-2. "Slave-soldiers?" " Owned Men?" However you translate Mamluk, James Waterson's account of their long history deserves your consideration. He takes you from their beginnings, when Arab leaders purchased Central Asian boys for conversion, both to Islam and as bodyguards, all the way to the end of their story – early 19th Century Egypt. During the 1000 plus years separating these events, Mamluks not only play a critical role in domestic politics, but also figure prominently in thwarting both European Crusaders and several Mongol invasions of the Middle East. These latter events show the Mamluks at their best, when their tremendous skills as horsemen and warriors allowed for history-altering victories like Ayn Jalut (1260), or the fall of Acre (1291). Waterson shows how Mamluk armies, almost exclusively cavalry, managed to be both good horse archers, and excellent shock troops. He also illustrates their significant skills at siege warfare, and use of "catapults." Even after their apogee in the 1200s, Mamluks figure prominently in the military affairs of North East Africa and the Near East. The Knights of Islam details this, especially the 1300s-1500s, when Mamluk armies, though in decline, were still capable of defeating the Ottoman Empire when directed by smart leaders like Kayitbay. Waterson continues their story, even after the Ottoman conquest of Egypt in 1516, for Mamluks influenced that nation's history into the 1800s, while they also influenced Ottoman military culture. Although wars and battles figure prominently, as they should in any account of Mamluks, Waterson does not leave out politics, economic matters, recruitment, or training. This reader liked his explanation of Furusiyya – a set of training lessons that began when Mamluks reached [End Page 227] 13/14, and included horsemanship plus weapons handling. He also makes very clear the most serious flaw within this system – internal rivalries between household forces of rival Mamluk leaders, often so intense that they played into the hands of foreign enemies. These details and many more, are well covered in The Knights of Islam. Waterson's clear writing is enhanced by a strong command of the secondary literature, and good use of translated primary sources. His text is nicely organized, supported by a glossary, maps, a time-line, plus a first-rate collection of color photos, and a useful bibliography. Specialists may argue on a few issues, pointing out that Egypt's Muhammad Ali can not be shortened to "Ali," or asking the photo editor to reconsider plate 37, which is dated to the "1880s," even though the British soldiers clearly have Wolseley pattern sun helmets. Most readers, however, should find the Knights of Islam interesting. It could benefit parties focused on Medieval, Islamic, Egyptian, or military history." Unquote. Last edited by Ibrahiim al Balooshi; 7th July 2017 at 11:20 PM. |
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I put the European archery book in here for interest... See here for a translation of the blue book https://www.archerylibrary.com/books.../arab-archery/ Last edited by Ibrahiim al Balooshi; 7th July 2017 at 09:35 PM. |
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#18 |
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A bibliography of Asian archery (books only).
Primary sources: Faris & Elmer, "Arab Archery", noted and linked upthread Latham, J. D., W. F. Paterson, and Ṭaybughā, "Saracen Archery: An English Version and Exposition of a Mameluke Work on Archery (Ca. A.D. 1368)", London: Holland P., 1970. http://pgmagirlscouts.files.wordpres...en_archery.pdf Jie Tian & Justin Ma, "The Way of Archery" https://www.amazon.com/Way-Archery-C...dp/0764347918/ Stephen Selby, "Chinese Archery" Not a single primary source, but a collection of a variety of sources. Gives the original and a translation in English, plus discussion. https://www.amazon.com/Chinese-Arche...dp/9622095011/ Joseph Needham & Robin D. S. Yates, "Science and Civilisation in China: Volume 5, Chemistry and Chemical Technology; Part 6, Military Technology: Missiles and Sieges" Not a single primary source, but a collection of a variety of sources. https://www.amazon.com/Science-Civil...dp/052132727X/ https://archive.org/stream/ScienceAn...les_and_Sieges Modern sources: Manouchehr Moshtagh Khorasani, "Persian Archery and Swordsmanship" http://www.freelanceacademypress.com...dsmanship.aspx Paul Klopsteg, "Turkish Archery". Recently reprinted, and cheap! https://www.amazon.com/Turkish-Arche...dp/1684220092/ Adam Karpowicz, "Ottoman Turkish bows" https://www.amazon.com/Ottoman-Turki...dp/B013MCOYMW/ G.N. Pant, "Indian Archery" https://www.amazon.com/Indian-Archer...dp/8173200149/ Charles E. Grayson, "Traditional Archery from Six Continents" https://www.amazon.com/Traditional-A...dp/0826217516/ Stephen Selby, "Archery Traditions of Asia" http://www.atarn.org/commercial/traditions.htm Last edited by Timo Nieminen; 8th July 2017 at 03:25 AM. |
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#19 |
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PLEASE SEE ~
AND SIMPLY COPY THIS STRING INTO YOUR WEB SEARCH WINDOW HTML Code:
file:///C:/Users/Peeter/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$DI00.156/Arab%20Archery.pdf This entire book is out of copyright and free for anyone to download. ![]() Regards, Ibrahiim al Balooshi. |
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#20 | |
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http://www.freepdf.info/index.php?post/Arab-Archery |
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#21 | |
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![]() There are quite a few ways into the document and heres another https://www.archerylibrary.com/books.../arab-archery/ where you simply go down the list and press on a link ... It also has other good archery links... |
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