Frey Collection Picit

Jean · 28th March 2017, 08:27 PM

David,
Sorry for the confusion and from the first & last pics especially the buntut may be made from walrus ivory indeed (marble appearance). Frey should be correct on this issue, otherwise he would not have mentioned it.
Something more wrong with this kris? The picit IMO unless it was a common feature of the Malay blades, which I don't know.
Regards

David · 29th March 2017, 04:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jean

Something more wrong with this kris? The picit IMO unless it was a common feature of the Malay blades, which I don't know.
Regards

Well again, i'm not sure i would use the word "wrong". I personally am not aware of picit being at all common in Malay blades. In fact i am not sure i have ever seen this feature in anything other than a Javanese blade. But that is a large part of what makes this blade intriguing to me.

Battara · 29th March 2017, 04:59 AM

I can clear some of this up. The "rainbow" look is not the photography but is real - actual patina. In person it is the same look to the metal.

David · 29th March 2017, 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

I can clear some of this up. The "rainbow" look is not the photography but is real - actual patina. In person it is the same look to the metal.

Thanks for the hands on report José. If i were the new owner i would probably have it tested, especially given the price the piece went for, but i doesn't make this keris any less attractive and intriguing for me.

David · 29th March 2017, 07:45 PM

I did a little research and tracked down the actual auction.
For what it's worth the auction house attests that it is all pure gold. I cannot verify their claim without the piece in hand, of course, but it does seem unlikely that an auction of this stature would lie about such an important component to potential bidding.

http://www.invaluable.com/auction-lo...ia*-AB640A98B5

kai · 29th March 2017, 10:22 PM

Hello David,

Quote:

For what it's worth the auction house attests that it is all pure gold.

I have yet to know any auction house that guarantees any item descriptions. I guess they just went with Frey's collection notes without any scrutinizing.

Considering the patination on the front side, I also believe this is gilded silver; I'd also be extremely surprised if the selut were solid gold (usually these are fire-gilded at best). Why the wear is on the front side while the back side seems still intact is anybody's guess...

I agree that the real worth of any keris should be in the blade though.

Regards,
Kai

David · 29th March 2017, 10:55 PM

Yep. While i will pass no judgement on the material it could quite possibly be as you say. People don't always tell the truth. Go figure!

But it is that blade i find really interesting. As has been noted, i can't think of any picit blades outside of Jawa. Perhaps a few. Anybody? This blade had been in Frey's collection at least since the early 80s and probably longer. But it does not appear to be a Javanese blade to my eyes. I know nothing about the resurgence of keris production in Malaysia, only that it had been practically dead in Jawa post WWII until the 1970s when it got a kick start through the encouragement of people like Dietrich Drescher so i am inclined to think that this must be a pre-WWII blade at the very least. I would be interested in hearing if someone has a different interpretation, but i would not think that a blade like this would have been made between the time the war and the 1980s perhaps anywhere in Indonesia. I would be very interested to know if anyone is aware of a tradition of picit blades outside of Jawa.

silberschatzimsee · 31st March 2017, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kai

I have yet to know any auction house that guarantees any item descriptions. I guess they just went with Frey's collection notes without any scrutinizing.

A big gun auction house in fairfield usa claims to do so.

Concerning the metal, i also think its gilded silver.

28th March 2017, 08:27 PM	#1
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	David, Sorry for the confusion and from the first & last pics especially the buntut may be made from walrus ivory indeed (marble appearance). Frey should be correct on this issue, otherwise he would not have mentioned it. Something more wrong with this kris? The picit IMO unless it was a common feature of the Malay blades, which I don't know. Regards

29th March 2017, 04:59 AM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,361	I can clear some of this up. The "rainbow" look is not the photography but is real - actual patina. In person it is the same look to the metal.

29th March 2017, 07:45 PM	#5
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,258	I did a little research and tracked down the actual auction. For what it's worth the auction house attests that it is all pure gold. I cannot verify their claim without the piece in hand, of course, but it does seem unlikely that an auction of this stature would lie about such an important component to potential bidding. http://www.invaluable.com/auction-lo...ia*-AB640A98B5

29th March 2017, 10:55 PM	#7
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,258	Yep. While i will pass no judgement on the material it could quite possibly be as you say. People don't always tell the truth. Go figure! But it is that blade i find really interesting. As has been noted, i can't think of any picit blades outside of Jawa. Perhaps a few. Anybody? This blade had been in Frey's collection at least since the early 80s and probably longer. But it does not appear to be a Javanese blade to my eyes. I know nothing about the resurgence of keris production in Malaysia, only that it had been practically dead in Jawa post WWII until the 1970s when it got a kick start through the encouragement of people like Dietrich Drescher so i am inclined to think that this must be a pre-WWII blade at the very least. I would be interested in hearing if someone has a different interpretation, but i would not think that a blade like this would have been made between the time the war and the 1980s perhaps anywhere in Indonesia. I would be very interested to know if anyone is aware of a tradition of picit blades outside of Jawa.