Montagnard Dha tribal association?

Ian · 29th December 2016, 10:56 AM

AzurePark:

You mention other photos that you have of this sword. I would be interested to see what you have of the multisection hilt. In my experience these hilts were usually made in two or three parts, but I cannot make out how many are actually present here. The decoration of the hilt with geometric designs would also be of interest, with more close up pictures. Lastly, if you could post pictures of the blade, particularly the edge to see if it is hardened, and of any distinguishing marks on the blade (although I'm not expecting there will be any to be found).

Regards,

Ian

AzurePark · 29th December 2016, 06:28 PM

Thank you everybody, I'm so glad that this much information can be determined!

At Ian's request I'm putting up more hilt photographs.

Ian · 29th December 2016, 09:44 PM

AzurePark:

Thanks for the additional pictures. The hilt has been handled a great deal and presumably put to much use. A sword with a proud history most likely.

The hilt is typical Lao work of the 18th-19th C, as several of us have commented earlier in this thread. There appear to be three parts to the hilt, with a small cylindrical mid-section flanked by two longer sections. Much of the original decoration has worn off, but there is enough left to identify typical Lao patterns of the stated period.

This is a genuine antique sword of some monetary value, but its commemorative value is far greater.

Thank you again for the pictures.

Sgt. Thornhill's service to the local population was recognized during his lifetime, just as we remember gratefully his service and sacrifice for us.

Ian.

AzurePark · 29th December 2016, 10:54 PM

Thank you, everybody! It's wonderful to learn that we have such a treasure here. The sword will be in an exhibit about votive giving at the Bard Graduate Center, together with other highlights from the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Collection, and our goal is to communicate the spiritual power of these objects.

I've got some blade and hilt close-ups coming up next. The blade is a tad rusty so any edge pattern might be hard to discern.

AzurePark · 29th December 2016, 10:57 PM

Here's some more close-ups of the handle.

AzurePark · 29th December 2016, 11:11 PM

These ones round out the scabbard close-ups.

Ian · 29th December 2016, 11:24 PM

AzurePark:

The additional pictures are helpful and confirm an antique blade with evidence of old, stable, spidery areas of oxidation as well as some active rust. Your conservator needs to attend to the active rust and prevent it from corroding the sword further. Once the active rust is removed it should either be oiled frequently or treated with a silicone wax, such as Renaissance Wax--but I'm sure your folks know how to preserve these types of artifacts.

I don't see a hardened edge but that does not mean much on a blade of this age. Personally, I would not etch the blade to try to find a hardened edge--simply remove the active rust and conserve it.

Please post a notice here of when the exhibition will be open and where it will be held.

Ian.

Battara · 29th December 2016, 11:34 PM

Looks like the hilt is made of sections of bronze.

Sajen · 30th December 2016, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

Looks like the hilt is made of sections of bronze.

It could be from samrit.

AzurePark · 29th December 2016, 11:09 PM

Here are the scabbard close-ups. It seems the two pieces of wood are held together by this cane or rattan wrapping, but is this kind of scabbard usually wrapped all the way, or just in deliberately spaced bands? Is the cane the only thing holding the two slats together, or is there ever some kind of chappe, nail, or peg?

29th December 2016, 10:56 AM	#1
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,397	AzurePark: You mention other photos that you have of this sword. I would be interested to see what you have of the multisection hilt. In my experience these hilts were usually made in two or three parts, but I cannot make out how many are actually present here. The decoration of the hilt with geometric designs would also be of interest, with more close up pictures. Lastly, if you could post pictures of the blade, particularly the edge to see if it is hardened, and of any distinguishing marks on the blade (although I'm not expecting there will be any to be found). Regards, Ian Last edited by Ian; 29th December 2016 at 12:40 PM.

29th December 2016, 06:28 PM	#2
AzurePark Member Join Date: Nov 2016 Posts: 6	Thank you everybody, I'm so glad that this much information can be determined! At Ian's request I'm putting up more hilt photographs. Attached Images

29th December 2016, 10:54 PM	#4
AzurePark Member Join Date: Nov 2016 Posts: 6	Thank you, everybody! It's wonderful to learn that we have such a treasure here. The sword will be in an exhibit about votive giving at the Bard Graduate Center, together with other highlights from the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Collection, and our goal is to communicate the spiritual power of these objects. I've got some blade and hilt close-ups coming up next. The blade is a tad rusty so any edge pattern might be hard to discern. Attached Images

29th December 2016, 10:57 PM	#5
AzurePark Member Join Date: Nov 2016 Posts: 6	Here's some more close-ups of the handle. Attached Images

29th December 2016, 11:11 PM	#6
AzurePark Member Join Date: Nov 2016 Posts: 6	These ones round out the scabbard close-ups. Attached Images

29th December 2016, 09:44 PM	#3
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,397	AzurePark: Thanks for the additional pictures. The hilt has been handled a great deal and presumably put to much use. A sword with a proud history most likely. The hilt is typical Lao work of the 18th-19th C, as several of us have commented earlier in this thread. There appear to be three parts to the hilt, with a small cylindrical mid-section flanked by two longer sections. Much of the original decoration has worn off, but there is enough left to identify typical Lao patterns of the stated period. This is a genuine antique sword of some monetary value, but its commemorative value is far greater. Thank you again for the pictures. Sgt. Thornhill's service to the local population was recognized during his lifetime, just as we remember gratefully his service and sacrifice for us. Ian.

29th December 2016, 11:24 PM	#7
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,397	AzurePark: The additional pictures are helpful and confirm an antique blade with evidence of old, stable, spidery areas of oxidation as well as some active rust. Your conservator needs to attend to the active rust and prevent it from corroding the sword further. Once the active rust is removed it should either be oiled frequently or treated with a silicone wax, such as Renaissance Wax--but I'm sure your folks know how to preserve these types of artifacts. I don't see a hardened edge but that does not mean much on a blade of this age. Personally, I would not etch the blade to try to find a hardened edge--simply remove the active rust and conserve it. Please post a notice here of when the exhibition will be open and where it will be held. Ian.

29th December 2016, 11:34 PM	#8
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,280	Looks like the hilt is made of sections of bronze.

29th December 2016, 11:09 PM	#10
AzurePark Member Join Date: Nov 2016 Posts: 6	Here are the scabbard close-ups. It seems the two pieces of wood are held together by this cane or rattan wrapping, but is this kind of scabbard usually wrapped all the way, or just in deliberately spaced bands? Is the cane the only thing holding the two slats together, or is there ever some kind of chappe, nail, or peg? Attached Images