PBX

[Kulino]

Elaborate
Dear mr. Maisey,
Thank you for your elaborate answer. I'm not sure how my education in keris compares to your knowledge. One of my teachers descended from the kraton Solo, my other teacher is related to the kraton Yogja. I believe them both to be honest and truthful. I would refer to inside the kraton as to the place where the Isi of the kraton is kept, guarded. Outside would be the face that is shown to the outside world.
However, I wonder if this is still a topic which should be discussed on this forum. I would be happier to exchange ideas in a different way.
Because of your response I will try to give words to my ideas.
I hope you agree with me that Javanese are very private persons. Sharing feelings, inner thoughts doesn' t come easy to them. As I was taught keris reflect large parts of this inner world, their personal inner world (if not all). Showing core pusaka and thus revealing your inner core during public cleaning ceremonies, would therefore impossible, not done. Fear of contamination, stealing Isi, giving insight in the inner core, a no go area.. I was told, the keris used during these ceremonies were copies. The real pusaka would stay inside, out of sight, guarded by the keepers.
Again, this story sounds very plausible to me. Apart from my two sources, I cannot verify this story. Saying it is true would reveal a plausible strategy, but also a scam. Denying it would support the current status: pure on the inside, stained/weak on the outside. This idea could be supported by the way the keris sajen looks. Nothing cosmetic, pure. The seals showing an intimate connection to Paku Buana.
To me, it is enough to relate to the keris who are in my house.
Not paying homage to keris does not mean, not caring or not looking after. They are family. One could consider this as a different perspective.
To me, it differs from keris to keris, depending on its function.

Do you have any comment on the dapur?

[ariel]

Who or what is PBX?

[A. G. Maisey]

PBX = Sampeyan Dalam ingkang Sinuhun ingkang Minula saha ingkang Wijaksana Kanjeng Susuhanan Prabhu Sri Pakubuwono X Senapati ing Alaga Ngah 'Abdu'l-Rahman Saiyid ud-din Panatagama

He would have had a couple of Dutch honorifics as well, that I used to know but have forgotten.

He was the Susuhunan ( ruler ) of Surakarta from 1893 to 1939.

That's why we usually shorten the names of these Javanese rulers to "PB + number" for Surakarta, and "HB + number" for Jogjakarta. In normal conversation we refer to the current PB as "Sinuhun" , I cannot give a direct translation for "Sinuhun" but it is a term of address used for a ruler, maybe a bit like "Your Highness", or "Lord".

You can also hear it used by domestic servants to their employers, especially in a sarcastic tone and with elaborations.

[A. G. Maisey]

Kulino, you may address me as Alan.

You have raised a number questions with your most recent post, and I will interpolate my responses.

Thank you for your elaborate answer. I'm not sure how my education in keris compares to your knowledge. One of my teachers descended from the kraton Solo, my other teacher is related to the kraton Yogja. I believe them both to be honest and truthful.

All people are honest and all people are truthful, however, honesty and truthfulness has different levels, thus honesty and truthfulness towards one person is not necessarily the same as honesty and truthfulness towards another person.
Then, in Jawa there is the ingrained cultural reflex that absolutely militates against the concept of gratuitous truth. In simple terms gratuitous truth is never welcome.
The natural result of this is that in a situation where one has a relationship with another person that permits the exchange of information in a form that is as accurate as the informant is prepared to indulge in, that accurate information will only come in response to a question that demonstrates that the person asking the question is ready to receive the accurate answer.

I would refer to inside the kraton as to the place where the Isi of the kraton is kept, guarded.

So in fact you were talking about the Royal Pusakas.
Yes, agreed, these can be regarded as objects to which access is severely limited.
However, it would be very wise to investigate the nature of the Royal pusakas of Surakarta, a good place to start might be Ricklefs: "The Missing Pusakas of Kartasura". Then of course we have the concept of 'mutrani'.

There are levels of knowledge and levels of permitted understanding.


Outside would be the face that is shown to the outside world.
However, I wonder if this is still a topic which should be discussed on this forum. I would be happier to exchange ideas in a different way.


For my part I have never put anything into this Forum nor into any other publicly accessible place that is unfit for general knowledge, nor will I.


Because of your response I will try to give words to my ideas.
I hope you agree with me that Javanese are very private persons. Sharing feelings, inner thoughts doesn' t come easy to them.

This depends totally upon the relationship, and upon the nature of the people involved. But yes, as a general rule it is correct behaviour to act in a restrained manner in public and with those judged to be on a different emotional level. As above, "gratuitous truth is unwelcome", and this means all gratuitous truth. The behaviour pattern is probably the result of the extremely hierarchical society.

As I was taught keris reflect large parts of this inner world, their personal inner world (if not all). Showing core pusaka and thus revealing your inner core during public cleaning ceremonies, would therefore impossible, not done.

The concept of public cleaning ceremonies never occurred to me. This is simply not done. If it occurs it is for the people who are still children. One does not parade one's personal possessions for all the world to see, and this applies most especially with one's keris, as the keris in fact represents the man who has custody of it.


Fear of contamination, stealing Isi, giving insight in the inner core, a no go area.. I was told, the keris used during these ceremonies were copies. The real pusaka would stay inside, out of sight, guarded by the keepers.

Any such ceremony, should it occur in Central Jawa could be regarded as sandiwara, something to amuse yg belum dewasa.


Again, this story sounds very plausible to me. Apart from my two sources, I cannot verify this story. Saying it is true would reveal a plausible strategy, but also a scam. Denying it would support the current status: pure on the inside, stained/weak on the outside. This idea could be supported by the way the keris sajen looks. Nothing cosmetic, pure. The seals showing an intimate connection to Paku Buana.
To me, it is enough to relate to the keris who are in my house.



What one truly believes is reality for he who truly believes it.
Nowhere is this more true than in Jawa, and within Javanese society, nowhere does this maxim apply more accurately than to keris related ideas.


Not paying homage to keris does not mean, not caring or not looking after. They are family. One could consider this as a different perspective.
To me, it differs from keris to keris, depending on its function.

"what one truly believes ---"

Do you have any comment on the dapur?

No, not really. I cannot give it an accurate name, it does not look like Jawa Tengah, but more like North Coast. In Solo I think most people would probably give it as campur bawur luk tujuh, but strictly speaking it cannot be campur bawur. Light gonjo, long point, North Coast or Madura Sepuh maybe.

[David]

Originally Posted by ariel

Who or what is PBX?

Ariel, i think you might find this answer a bit less "occult" than Alan's.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakubuwono_X

[A. G. Maisey]

He was a bit of a cult figure, still is if truth be known.

Really good at two things:- spending money and fathering children.

I've met a number of people who claimed that he was their ancestor, including my housekeeper, whose mother was one of the Karaton dancers.

Here he is:-

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakubu...r_10001903.jpg

[Kulino]

Dear Alan ,
You honour me with the privilege of using your first name. Thank you.
You are right, it is all what you choose to believe in.
Seems to work for me though.
The old ways appear to be on the verge of being lost.
When I asked my teacher if he was sad or sorry that all this knowledge is about to disappear he replied very philosophically, if it is worth something it will survive. If not, it will disappear.
True, but sad. This forum proves that there is still some interest, which is nice. Sharing ideas with you and your comments are a delight. I will post more interesting keris for your consideration.

Njirami could be interpreted as the occasion where the court pusaka would have been cleaned, publicly. I haven’t attended one personally so I can’t report first hand to what extend the used pusaka are clearly visible or how close the public could come to the site. Using private keris during this event would be impossible to me.

If you are into keris kuno, the ones from Madura are a pain. A few years ago I sat with pak Eko, a mranggi, ahli keris in the Yogja area and we discussed these keris, comparing old with new. He expected that in the near future it would be increasingly difficult to tell old from new, even for the experts. From what I see now, he was right. At least for the starting collector. You really have to have had hundreds of keris passing through your hands to tell right from wrong. And even then, there are the ones which make you doubt.

[A. G. Maisey]

I feel myself that it is not a matter the value of something that permits it to survive, but rather its relevance, and within a society the relevance of anything varies dependent upon the layer or segment of society that is considered.

In Jawa, if we put a culturally based question, the same question, to people who come from different segments of the society, we will sometimes get very different answers. That which is relevant to a farmer who is still using traditional methods is not at all relevant to somebody who has completed a university degree and wants both himself, and his country to be seen as a part of the "Modern World".

Yes, I do understand the PR displays that the Karatons put on, but once again I do most sincerely suggest that the nature of at least the Surakarta pusakas be given a very close look.

In respect of identification of old keris, one does not need to have handled hundreds of keris. This is very, very far from reality.

One needs to have handled thousands of keris and to have handled a good number of those under the guidance of somebody who truly understands what he is looking at.

How to do this at the present time?

I do not know.

[Kulino]

You gave better words to these concepts than I did. Since I'm not a native speaker in English it is always hard to find the correct words or phrases to express the nuances felt. Thank you Alan.
Indeed, over the last fourty years I saw thousands of keris passing through my hands, discussing them with many others, among which many ahli keris both in Europe and on Jawa. This is the only way to learn.
I'm used to look at lots of details like shapes of gandik, selassih, endas cicak, gandja, puncuk of the blade, definition of the pecetan area, the general appearance of the blad itself (condro), shape and construction of the peksi, all in combination with sound of the metal, skin, colour, weight, balance and sometimes even the scent. I find this not to be an exact science.
I'm always eager to learn more. Is is appropriate to ask where I can find the criteria Empu Suparman used for his determination?