Ottoman Balkan Miquelet muskets

Cerjak · 22nd August 2016, 10:51 AM

more pics

Kubur · 22nd August 2016, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cerjak

more pics

Hi Cerjak,

I'm sure that you have seen the name of the gunmaker and the date.
They are yours??
Are you sure that you need two Boyliya?

Cerjak · 22nd August 2016, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubur

Hi Cerjak,

I'm sure that you have seen the name of the gunmaker and the date.
Hi Kubur,
Yes Kubur Atlanta and Dom already did this job.
They are yours??
yes of course
Are you sure that you need two Boyliya?
yes you are right I need more than 2 !

rickystl · 27th August 2016, 03:56 PM

Hi Cerjak.

Thank you for posting these updated photos. Those Boyliyas are beautiful. And in very nice condition. Even with a slight variation in decoration, you can see the general pattern for the Boyliya being very similar. And notice the butt stocks made in two pieces. I remember in the earlier posts discussing the diiferent theories for the two-piece butt stocks on many Ottoman style guns.

I notice this Tufuk musket has the extra short butt stock, but a full length barrel. Some thought these guns originally had longer butt stocks that may have been damaged and repaired leaving it short, requiring it to be shot from the cheek, Japanese matchlock style. But I've never thought this to be true. I've seen too many examples of the Tufuk made this way. Still not sure why.

Anyway, very nice pieces ALL !!! I still do not have a Boyliya in my collection.

Rick

Oliver Pinchot · 27th August 2016, 04:28 PM

The tufek is absolutely missing the butt.

Cerjak · 28th August 2016, 03:24 PM

Hi Rick and Olivier,
Thank you for your comment.
Some better pictures.
Best cerjak

rickystl · 28th August 2016, 04:39 PM

Hi Cerjak.

Thanks for the additional photos. That helps a bunch.
To me, this gun with the short butt stock was made this way. The brass decoration and bone butt cap at the heel of the stock all look correct. If a rear portion of the butt stock were damaged, or otherwise missing, it would be little effort to simply add the new wood and re-install the bone butt cap. But I have seen photos and held many that were obviously made short this way.
I had the thought that the short butt stock might might allow the shooter to fire from the waist area while on horseback ala blunderbuss knee pistol style. Which I guess could be done. But then, there would be no need for a rear sight. And the pistol would be a much handier weapon on horseback. My only conclusion at present is that they were made for aiming/firing from the cheek, with the arms taking the recoil vs the shoulder. Just my best guess.

Although not as nice as Cerjak's, here is another example with the short butt stock.

Rick

Cerjak · 28th August 2016, 04:08 PM

Hi Rick and Olivier,
Thank you for your comment.
Some better pictures.
Best cerjak

22nd August 2016, 10:51 AM	#1
Cerjak Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: FRANCE Posts: 1,065	more pics more pics Attached Images

28th August 2016, 03:24 PM	#6
Cerjak Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: FRANCE Posts: 1,065	Hi Rick and Olivier, Thank you for your comment. Some better pictures. Best cerjak Attached Images

28th August 2016, 04:39 PM	#7
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,630	Hi Cerjak. Thanks for the additional photos. That helps a bunch. To me, this gun with the short butt stock was made this way. The brass decoration and bone butt cap at the heel of the stock all look correct. If a rear portion of the butt stock were damaged, or otherwise missing, it would be little effort to simply add the new wood and re-install the bone butt cap. But I have seen photos and held many that were obviously made short this way. I had the thought that the short butt stock might might allow the shooter to fire from the waist area while on horseback ala blunderbuss knee pistol style. Which I guess could be done. But then, there would be no need for a rear sight. And the pistol would be a much handier weapon on horseback. My only conclusion at present is that they were made for aiming/firing from the cheek, with the arms taking the recoil vs the shoulder. Just my best guess. Although not as nice as Cerjak's, here is another example with the short butt stock. Rick Attached Images

27th August 2016, 03:56 PM	#4
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,630	Hi Cerjak. Thank you for posting these updated photos. Those Boyliyas are beautiful. And in very nice condition. Even with a slight variation in decoration, you can see the general pattern for the Boyliya being very similar. And notice the butt stocks made in two pieces. I remember in the earlier posts discussing the diiferent theories for the two-piece butt stocks on many Ottoman style guns. I notice this Tufuk musket has the extra short butt stock, but a full length barrel. Some thought these guns originally had longer butt stocks that may have been damaged and repaired leaving it short, requiring it to be shot from the cheek, Japanese matchlock style. But I've never thought this to be true. I've seen too many examples of the Tufuk made this way. Still not sure why. Anyway, very nice pieces ALL !!! I still do not have a Boyliya in my collection. Rick

27th August 2016, 04:28 PM	#5
Oliver Pinchot Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 464	The tufek is absolutely missing the butt.

28th August 2016, 04:08 PM	#8
Cerjak Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: FRANCE Posts: 1,065	Hi Rick and Olivier, Thank you for your comment. Some better pictures. Best cerjak